What’s the Deal With the Grateful Dead?

Bob,

Personally, you've hit the nail right on the head for me. I've lived in Missoula since '93 and never understood our lovely local Greatful Dead infatuation. Just recently, I was given the opportunity to listen to a bunch of "Dick's Pick's" at my own pace to really try and see if I could understand what all the hub bub around this movement was about. An honest listen and an open mind we my intentions as I entered in to this experiment.

I've got a better chance of having my wife agree with me that it would be o.k. for our son to have a sleepover at Michael Jackson's house than I do understanding why folks go so ape shit crazy for this music. It kind of reminds me of eating at the Pekin Noodle Parlor in Butte after a heavy night of drinking. Noodle, Noodle, Noodle, Mumble, Noodle. Repeat until you pass out.

Your missing the point by even considering them a studio band. They werent . They were a live,touring band. And you failed to mention LSD. it makes them sound better especially if you take it one hour before the show. Peaking during the best part of the show.
You never did that I guess.

"They arent the best at what they do ,just the only ones doing it"
or sumthing like that, Bill Graham. Do you know of him?

30 years of absolutely positively crappy singing.

They pioneered and experimented with some stuff live like the wall of sound and earpieces to hear the soundboard guys . dont forget free taping of shows. and Grill cheese sandwiches,and mushrooms.

Probably you'd better wait until your muse pisses in your ear next time...

Don't forget the Anthem to Sun album for which they took these concert tape (encompassing two Los Angeles shows from November 1967, a tour of the Pacific Northwest in January/early-February 1968, and a California tour from mid-February to mid-March 1968) and began interlacing them with existing studio tracks. This was never done before. Look it up stupid. You should really read before you open you mouth.

THE WALL OF SOUND was revolutionary....

Oh FYI Jerry is number 13 on rollingstones top 100 Greatest Guitarest. Per rollign stones - Garcia was a folk and blue-grass obsessive who started playing guitar at fifteen. It was those roots, as well as a lifelong love of Chuck Berry, that gave his astral experiments with the Grateful Dead a sense of forward momentum. Garcia could dazzle on slide ("Cosmic Charlie") or pedal steel ("Dire Wolf"), but his natural home was playing lead onstage, exploring the frontier of psychedelic sound. The piercing lyricism of this tone was all the more remarkable for the fact that he was missing the third finger of his right hand � the result of a childhood accident while he and his brother Tiff were chopping wood. He died in 1995 in rehab for his longtime drug habit. But his guitar still shines like a headlight on a northbound train.

Real quickly - the Dead DID break ground in the studio.

1. 1st see of live tracks edited with studio tracks for the Anthem of the Sun album.

2. I THINK they were the 1st to utilize 16 track recording as well.

pioneers? you might look up a little place called Alembic. Look into Owsley Stanley, dive into how they made "Anthem of the Sun." Wall of Sound is another good topic, live sound. in the field multi-track recording. Custom instrument manipulation. Damn, this list goes on and on.

Thanks, Dude and coltrane. This is what I'm looking for: illumination, not name-calling. Now I've got a new album on my must-listen list.

Absolutely. I've never tried to make a Dead fan out of a non fan, but I know people who hate the Dead but realize they had a big impact on today. I mean Miles Davis was a fan, how bad could they be? Winton Marsalis? Thanks for looking deeper.

I agree, meh....
The current spouse followed 'em around one summer and had a blast. It was the acid according to her. She never listens to it anymore.
BTW Bob, I'm back from the windy city and have some great tales, I'll write later...

And Travis, I respect your opinion, but the Rolling Stone Top 100 Guitarists of All Time? The same list that omitted Billy Gibbons, Brian Setzer and Ted Nugent? The same list that put Eddie Van Halen at #70? So much for their credibility in the guitarist dept.

Got a better idea rent Anthem to Beauty DVD.

Excerpt : The video combines footage from the early years of the Grateful Dead with 1997 interviews of former band members and associates. Phil Lesh, Mickey Hart, Bob Weir, Robert Hunter, and David Grisman, among others, discuss the creation of 1968's experimental, psychedelic Anthem of the Sun and 1970's folk-rock classic American Beauty. They also listen to and analyze the original master recordings for the albums, and talk about being in (or working with) the Grateful Dead at that time. Recording engineer Stephen Barncard rolls the original master tape and solos tracks, recalling the recording sessions and highlighting specific moments.

That sounds pretty cool. Hopefully not too cool for Netflix...

Fair enough on the list thing but he came in at 70 on the digitaldeamdoor.com list. Who is the digitaldreamdoor who knows but jerry is on it. I just was indicating that Jerry was on a top 100 list. You should also consider the Live Dead album, considered to be one of the best live albums of all time. Just remember when it was recorded to get a real sense of history around it. You know what else, the dead's web cite is awesome. It has ton of info for anyone to view.

Been listening for years. Check out dead.net. Two words: Uniquely American. Right up there with Walt Whitman, Louis Armstrong, Bill Monroe and the New York Yankees. Most of your piece rings true, Bob. They stunk in the studio, and nobody could sing (especially Garcia in his last years). They are one of the great American musical paradoxes. But 3,000 shows or so says something. And of course they were '60s-'70s icons for all us now graying nostalgic Boomers. Oh, and as a conservative, I'll throw this out there: If you read Dennis McNally's book "A Long Strange Trip" (I have twice), you'll see that the Dead were innovative and at times cutthroat capitalists (especially when deferring to Bill Graham). They incorporated as early as '69 or '70, and ran a business that eventually took care of 30-40 employees plus families. Now Garcia, Lesh, Weir, et al weren't the most hands-on CEOs, but they had great accountants and lawyers, especially "The Czar", the late Hal Kant (who grabbed Ben and Jerry by the throat over "Cherry Garcia"). Oh, one more thing: Sargeant Peppers. The Beatles were doing acid and listening to a lot of San Francisco music in the months before doing that groundbreaking record. Just my theory. And do see my recent "What's a Conservative Deadhead to Do?" in my American Spectator archive. A little shameless self promotion Grateful Dead, Inc. would smile at.

If you don't think they were pushing the boundaries when they began making music in the mid-late-sixties, I'm wondering if you haven't heard what they were doing then? Or if you haven't heard other pop music prior to and during that era? The Dead were certainly pushing boundaries...although they were preceded (as usual in pop/rock) by the mostly black musicians of the Jazz scene (see Mile Davis Bitches Brew era). They'd certainly admit that, I think.

Also, while they may not have been known for expanding what was possible in the studio, they certainly were responsible for exponential improvements in the quality of live concert sound/PA. See what they did with the Wall of Sound, '74, '75. It ended up being too bulky to be really efficient for a touring band, but was a precursor to more efficient, high quality concert PA. Most live shows in the late sixties and early 70's had abysmal sound, comparatively speaking.

Pretty funny post from someone who's name was, at first glance, Bob Wier.

I don't think the Dead should be universally loved. Like Miles Davis, they take a lot time and unique taste to really love. But when you start to love them, it's all over.

http://spectator.org/archives/2009/04/20/whats-a-conservative-deadhead

...

I never understood the attraction in terms of music. The first song I ever really liked was Touch of Grey, altho my dead headed friends repeatedly and ENDLESSLY played everything else within earshot, for years. I guess you had to be "there" -- and the only way to get "there" was to FLY, man.

The Grateful Dead and their various incarnations have always represented for me a celebration of spirit and connection. You either get it or you don't. Its like an inside joke...you either laugh or you don't. No point being hung-up on it.

The music the Grateful Dead played and continue to play provides those that get it with a connection, an escape if you will. There's no point trying to analyze it - that runs contrary to the intent.

not terrible. not particularly good. but the bottom line - never purchased a single track, record, ticket or cassette by GD. when i run accross it by accident, it sounds like hippy elevator music....although the few times in my life that i tolerated the sound long enough to listen to the words - they seemed ok. but, like i say- never invested a dime in any product from GD inc. probably never will.

do however very much like garcia in old and in the way....but then who doesn't?

Never did care what they sounded like...they were just a blast to follow around. My kids have a hard time believing I ever did such a thing, but it was the 60s and 70s, it was California, it was.....cloudy in the stadium ::::cough::::

i like the vibe of what both rich & kevin have expressed. it isn't for everyone but - if you get it, you get it...

"Deadheads are kinda like people who like licorice. Not everybody likes licorice, but people who like licorice, *really* like licorice!"
-jerry garcia

The grateful dead will be around forever!

This generated as many comments as the prostitution story on the GF Tribune web site.

One more thing. They were anti-rock stars and philanthropists. They gave tons of money away, especially through the Relix Foundation. Favorite Garcia quote. Once when they were having some financial difficulties he was sitting with the band and their accountants and lawyers around a big conference table ,and as the suits crunched numbers and gave legal-fiscal advice Garcia sat back, lit a cigarette, and said in his chirpy voice: "Well, man, what I want to know is if we can continue to do all this and stay high". And he did, though maybe a bit too much.

Dead Facts

The Dead produced 164 songs over a 30 year career
The average true “Deadhead” spent over $2,000 on Dead concerts and travelled over 3,000 over the past 3 decades
It is recorded that one person actually spent $13,000
attending Dead concerts.
The Dead, over the length of their career, have performed to more people than any other band in history
Their song, “Touch of Gray” was an expression of Jerry Garcia’s determination to survive. The music was recorded shortly after Garcia recovered from a diabetic coma and the accompanying video features skeletons that transform into the members of the band.
The Grateful Dead are named after an old British ballad which sings about spirits that are called Grateful Dead when they finally are freed from whatever binds them to remain on Earth

i mean can you dig it? wow i love these guys.

what about Mickey Hart....? Grammy winner!!!!!!!

In 1991, Hart produced the album Planet Drum, which remained at #1 on the Billboard World Music Chart for 26 weeks, and received the first ever Grammy Award for Best World Music Album. I mean come on the dead are for real.

what is great about the dead well In 1964, when British Invasion bands like the Beatles and the Rolling Stones dominated American musical tastes, a little known San Francisco band was about to start another, entirely different, musical revolution. This band consisted of guitarists Jerry Garcia and Bob Weir, organist Ron McKernan, bassist Phil Lesh and drummer Bill Kreutzmann. They called themselves "The Grateful Dead."

Today the Grateful Dead are synonymous with musical greatness. After all, they ranked number 55 on Rolling Stone's list of 100 Greatest Bands of All Time and they received a Grammy Lifetime Achievement Award in 2007. But what is it that makes the Grateful Dead so great? For many, the answer to this question lies in the uniqueness of the band's sound and the fan culture that evolved from it.

The Grateful Dead's unique sound arose in part from the different background of each member. For example, Jerry Garcia had a love for bluegrass and the banjo, bassist Phil Lesh was a classically trained trumpet player with a music theory background, drummer Mickey Hart had an interest in eclectic drumming styles, and drummer Bill Kreutzmann had a jazz background. These interests, coupled with the band's decision to use electric guitars after seeing a performance by the Lovin' Spoonful, created the genre bending sound that has been a signature of the Grateful Dead. In any given Grateful Dead album or song, one might hear a fusion of blues, jazz, folk, bluegrass, gospel, rock and other genres.

Apart from their musical style, the Grateful Dead's live performances were another factor that elevated them to the status of greatness. The Grateful Dead were known for touring frequently and they performed thousands of concerts throughout their career. What was special about these concerts was that each one was different. Unlike most bands, the Grateful Dead did not play a specific set each night, preferring instead to perform whatever songs they felt like performing at the time. The band also featured a lot of improvisation at their concerts, and as a result became the first "jam band," a term that refers to bands that improvise and mix musical styles.

Because each Grateful Dead concert was different, some fans wanted to see as many as they could and became so dedicated that they followed the band from concert to concert, often supporting themselves by selling t-shirts, food and other memorabilia at the concerts. These loyal fans became known as "Deadheads." Although these Deadheads were loyal, it could be said that the Grateful Dead were just as loyal to them in return. In fact, in the beginning of their career, the Grateful Dead even provided free food and lodging to attendees at their Haight-Ashbury area concerts. Additionally, throughout their career they allowed fans to tape their concerts in designated taping areas. Fans were even allowed to share their recordings with each other, provided they did not attempt to make a profit from them.

The Grateful Dead enjoyed a lengthy career, from 1964 until 1995 when they formally disbanded after Jerry Garcia's death from a heart attack. Since then, remaining members of the Grateful Dead have embarked on solo projects including Phil Lesh's band, Phil Lesh and Friends, and Bob Weir's band, RatDog. In 2002, remaining members Phil Lesh, Bob Weir, Mickey Hart and Bruce Hornsby briefly toured as "The Other Ones" until they changed their name to "The Dead" in 2003. In 2008, The Dead performed a few shows in support of Barack Obama's presidential campaign. These shows spurred rumors that the Dead might tour in 2009. These rumors turned out to be true as the band announced tour dates for a tour that starts on April 12, 2009 in Greensboro, North Carolina. The Dead's lineup for the 2009 tour includes Bob Weir, Phil Lesh, Bill Kreutzmann, Mickey Hart, Warren

You are either blessed to have a Garciaesque sonic orgasm reception zone in your ears, heart, mind and spirit or you aren't. Most people are just indifferent or inexperienced about such things and some people like my mother; truly think they just suck and sound horrendous.
However to those of us who are intimately familiar with the aforementioned sonic stimulation site, this band was capable of producing the sweetest, jolliest, hip-dip happiest sounds the planet has ever known, as well as digging deep into the depths of heavy duty less than pleasant and even downright scary emotional space soundscapes as well.

Part of the equation Bob is the tone or sound style of Garcia's guitar. It is simply unmatched and just doesn't sound like the classic Strat or Les Paul rock tones that say a Clapton or a Hendrix will bring about in an entertaining but different manner. Trey Anastasio’s high pitched guitar tone is similar and no doubt plays a role as to why Phish is so popular with many deadheads. However I would say the lyrical song writing collaboration by the Dead's teams (Hunter-Garcia, Barlow-Weir), explores a much more tangible depth and elaboration of American culture and human experience than the more mystic fantasy oriented ramblings of many Phish lyrics.
The exceptionally stout and muscular sound of Phil Lesh’s earthquake shaking bass tones – these are not the rinky-dinky anemic sounding bass twang notes of say the Seinfeld theme, play a significant role as well. Like Garcia’s sweet soulful guitar tone there just doesn’t seem to be anybody who can duplicate the unique, richly textured, thump of Phil Lesh’s bass!

Part of what I see here Bob, is that you, like so many people have only been exposed to the very bland subdued and tamed studio versions of there popular radio station played songs like Touch of Gray, Casey Jones, and Truckin’ - three of their worst songs.
You hear any of these regular old studio versions on the radio and they're ok, but I can see how one could then be left extremely underwhelmed wondering how such average generic sounding music could inspire so many people to follow a band around spending so much time and money in so many different places, even if they were on a lot of drugs?!

No, no, no Bob, it really was all about the LIVE JAMS – during about 3000 different live performances in between 1965 to 1995. What you need to do to partially understand, is listen to the Truckin' from Hundred Year Hall that spirals into a 32 minute jam that doesn't even sound like Truckin after about 5 min but rather free form jazz that usurps the original structure in favor of synergistic signature solos that weave each musicians personal thought streams in to a woven soundscape that would at its best truly feed and follow one another in to the kind of legendary improvisational musical territory that very few musicians are even capable of conceptualizing ,let alone playing today.

Bob I can see how the whole Dead phenomenon seems and even sounds a bit flimsy and inexplicable when one just considers the very average studio product -but like many of the finest things in life one must dig deeper below the surface and ream the mines of treasure that are waiting to be discovered through solid ,open –minded exploration.

You also need to understand its also about the variety of styles from blues to rock, jazz, Caribbean and a very pronounced Country and Western flavor on songs like Me and My Uncle and Cumberland Blues which is kick-ass Hillbilly shitkickin romp and stomp at its finest as well as respectable covers of classics like El Paso and Big River.
But now catch them in the spaced out throes of a 45 minute Playin’ in the Band or Dark Star-well there you have the premiere examples of psychedelic soundscapes that dart all over the map of style though mainly mimicking top of the head free form improvisational jazz and almost defy belief as to the strength of strange found in the early acid soaked full throttle hard edged garage sound found within Anthem of the Sun material like a live 40 minute Cryptical Envelopment or Viola Lee Blues. Bolstered by Phil Lesh as enormously potent, robust bass notes the interplay between Garcia’s exceptionally swift banjo picking reminiscent speed notes combined with 2 drummers vying for rhythmic smotherance with festive or sassy key board spice can and often does deliver a style and veracity of honest spirited and downright unique, cool and comforting music as an art experience entertainment.

IN OTHER WORDS QUITE SIMPLY THEY KICK ASS BEYOND BEYOND LEGITIMATE ,REASONABLE ENGLISH DESCRIPTION!! I could go on and on as I’m obviously quite an enthusiast (the Thundersockeye tribe of cosmic Pacific hydrology was birthed after the last time I saw Stella Blue, but that’s a different story –Ahhhhhhhhhh?! Kind of like fine wine – an acquired yet mature and rewarding taste that’s worth growing.
Any how Bob do yourself a big favor and delve deeply in to the rewarding subculture of some of the strongest, strangest and best music American culture has ever amalgamated through listening to

1. Live Dead the album especially the Dark Star > St. Stephen> The Eleven Sequence
2. Two from the Vault
3. Hundred Year Hall – Truckin’> Cryptical> Comes a Time
4. Europe ’72 – Cumberland Blues, Jack Straw
5. Any Dick’s Picks – Just realize that this band evolves over time into about 5 or 6 very different, very distinctive formations and thus the acidic garage sound of the 60’s become a little more countrified by the early 70’s – even funkify into a slightly discofied ’76 to ’78 period and then on into to electric 80’s. What I am trying to say is the Grateful Dead of 1969 sound nothing like 1974 or 1977 or 1979 or say, 1987 is even different from 1989 or 1991. Believe me…you’ll see….or be bored long before you put forth the effort necessary to! Just remember they’re the opposite of the Beatles in that they don’t shine in the studio, but rather more through their instruments in long liver raw and unpolished variable performances.

Seek out versions of Scarlet Begonias>Fire on the Mountain, Help on the Way>Slipknot as well as Eyes of the World>Playin’ in the Band, Estimated Prophet and Lazy Lightning>Supplication, Cassidy, Let it Grow and Birdsong and on and on and on…ENJOY!

There is no accounting for taste. I'll never love Jagermeister and I'll never love Greatful Dead music. Two weeks ago I had the extreme pleasure to be at the Gorge for an Allman Brothers/ "Dead" line up. In terms of musicianship and all other things musical, the Allman Brothers were truly inspiring of awe. Then "The Dead" came on. Pee Wee Herman on a bike, man. Anemic, pathetic. And that's with Warren Haynes! Some people think PT Cruisers are cool. I and many others don't and never will. Let's just agree it takes all kinds to make the world go round' and call it good.

My music tastes are eclectic. My husband, on the other hand, is in a dual phase of gypsy music and Zydeco. He cranks up the Bose system every morning. Some mornings I feel like I'm in the movie "The Third Man" and other mornings I feel like I've been transported into the bayou. Long before I met him he was a jazz drummer in NYC and then gave it up.

...

There you go again, Bob, picking on hippies. I agree.

(Favorite Dead joke: Q. What did the Grateful Dead fan say when he ran out of drugs? A. "Hey, these guys suck!")

Someone already commented that the difference between the Beatles and the Dead was essentially studio vs touring band. Either type of band has its own strengths etc. The magic of the Dead was multi-fold:

1. Touring amount and longevity
2. Diversity of music played and diversity of ways the same song was played.
3. Bringing old songs and covers into the rotation - always worth seeing Grateful Dead several nights in a row.
4. Garcia was a magical guitarist and a decent singer. He could play and did play almost every genre of music. Don't know of other guitarists with the diversity of his playing styles. Yes he led the space/jam genre, his playing was much more than that. Chord changes were so complex, other guitarists would not even try to play his songs.
5. The scene at the concerts. The gathering of the tribes was always part of the Grateful Dead scene. Very peaceful, very respectful, always a continuation of the 60's.
6. Concerts were magical - audience spread by word of mouth unlike probably any other band.

Could go on, but diversity of music and songs, guitar skills etc were keys of the Grateful Dead and the reason for their following. Their best studio albums were probably Workingman's Dead, American Beauty, and In The Dark. The first two albums helped expose the Dead to a wider audience and helped propel them to popularity.

Chas

I'm not saying they were the best band ever. The music was important, but it was not the only part of the experience! If you haven't gotten it, I'm afraid to say you probably never will. Since Jerry's death, although they are still touring in one form or another, the whole Grateful Dead experience will never be the same. Just try to keep an open mind and I guarentee the music will sooth the soul!

I don't get sushi . . . but I don't write about it.

I had to work when my peers were being hippies and drugged out. Missed it all. You knew when there was a Dead concert in YewGene, Oreygawn, because the I-5 freeway suddenly had a dozen dead VW buses parked along it, most painted in some poor copy of the Kesey bus.

The last 20 years, Dead concerts were a reason to work for the State and have a pony tail, a tie dyed shirt, a beaded necklace, open toed shoes, and carry a man-purse. And some of those pony tails are pretty sparse---just a step above the cholos with the shaved head and tiny hair tail---and sort of a sad recognition of life quickly slipping away towards the golden years and the 101K.

The Dead must be an acquired taste. That is code for not that great, but very popular to a particular demographic and to a certain kind of snob. So, if you didn't run off a thousand miles to a concert at the drop of a hat (hard to do with kids and a job unless you work for the State and can use personal time off and flex time, all of which allows your being paid while getting high at the Dead concert) you are not a part of the whole deal and won't understand it. I guess I wasted my time taking a kid fishing. Damn the luck!!

The Grateful Dead going back to the Acid Tests days were inspired by the Beatles movie A Hard Days Night. They thought what fun it would be to live like rock stars and capitalize on their efforts since they were primarily a free house band. The nexsus of the San Francisco Bay area sound in the in later sixties was heavily crossed over from country and western genre with Credence Clearwater, The Riders of the Purple Sage, Quicksilver Messenger Service etc to name a few.
As for the recording studio becoming an instument, Jimi Hendrix bulit the Electric Ladyland Studios for that purpose with multi-tracking and advanced electronic nuances of the time.so plese do not give credit to the Beatles.

The Beatles proved that a band could record and not tour and make money.

The Dead proved a band could tour and not record and make money.

The Dead are the highest grossing touring band or act of any kind of all time, almost exclusively on tickets sold. They were a working band, sometimes playing 300 shows a year, year in and year out, between their various offshoot bands.

The Dead weren't their fans. It's clear you don't know what you are writing about when you say "...round the band’s message of peace, love and psycho-travel." In fact the Beatles are much closer to that description, at least based on their interviews and lyrics.

One time soon after The Dead released the Album "Touch of Grey" in the early 1990s (which was actually the first album to get a little bit of commercial radio play since the sixties) an interviewer asked Jerry about accusations some fans were making that the band had sold out. He replied, "We would have sold out a long time ago but nobody was buying."

I feel sorry for you that you don't get it. While I have no favorite band (i don't see music like that. I like good music of all sorts) i do like the Dead and have a lot of fond memories of a lot of great shows.

Working Man's Dead, Blues for Allah, and American Beauty are all great albums. But they weren't about albums very much.

I saw Lampoon's Electric Apricot : Quest for Festeroo last night. I think it sums up that whole stoned out dirty hippie jam band genre in an hour and 31 minutes. Now I'm no movie critic but I give it 4 stars for reinforcing my opinions about damn dirty hippies and their damn hippie music.
Cheers for Les Claypool !!!

Not to beat a dead horse -HA,HA -but We enthusiasts cannot stress enough ,its got to be LIVE,LIVE,LIVE and high enough sound Quality to hear the specific nuances of each band members contribution-for example the mix needs to be strong enough to let your body actually feel the unmatched richly textured throb of Phil Lesh;s bass or even Bob Weirs underrated Rhythym guitar accents and you need to sample 67-70 72 -74 ,77 and 87 -89 90-93 to hear an accurate representation of the bands evolution -youll think its 5 different bands!

As someone who takes this seriously I have always been embarrassed at how the studio versions on the radio must seem like really marginal boring exuses to party ,to the uninitiated ears that have yet to grasp the full fledged skill of musicianship and the resultant social ecstasy that would occur on any given day when such potent talent was met by the bright eyed if overly simplistic and naive enthusiasm of human beings genuinely reveling in a celebration of music,social equality and life itself -at its best!

Its corny but a big part of it was also the Peace and love part .Everyone whether fat ,skinny ,rich ,poor any race ,look,sexual orientation etc.was welcome to be part of the fun within the Dead scene-it was about being loved and accepted as a human being-typcal yet tangible hippy ,dippy themes.Its sad to say but I saw more genuine Christian love exemplified through actions ,on any given day in a parking lot of a Grateful Dead concert than I have ever at any church yet!Still it had many ugly sides too and was far from perfect.Which brings us back to the music which reaally is WORTH exploring!And unlike most bands you have about 6000 hours of live recordings to delve into -should be a long and sweet Summmer! So Bob head North again in to the wierder ,wilder country and start listening-Dark Star from Live Dead will tranport you to some very special ,pleasent places while camping and gazing at the sparkling twinkles of the bright ones dancing above your head ENJOY!

Ship of fools sail away from me. Try again, without trying. They were the summer of love... and did the work the others relished in.

I'm 58, I saw the Dead 16 times from 1970 to 1992.
and I hate to sound like an old fart but...
You had to have been there to really understand it... that and a chemically altered consciousness with 20,000 of your new best friends

Sadly I have 1700+ songs on my iPod and not 1 GD tune. Never did really care for the albums, but live the was just no experience like it.

Weirdest Show? - I saw them at Duke in 71 or 72 with The Beach Boys, New Riders of the Purple Sage and Leslie West's Mountain. Crowd was 40% hippies and 60% Duke Frat types... near-naked hippie chicks vs. the Sorority sister Preppy Girls was fun to watch. Lot of frat boys became hippies that night

What you are missing - live Dead show with Jerry. Alas, those are days gone...

Succinct, to the point, not condescending...

Best answer yet. Thank you.

There's not much I can add here that hasn't already been mentioned by previous commenters. However, the timing of your piece was appropriate for me, and this comment is being typed 18 years after my very first Grateful Dead show, at the Los Angeles Coliseum in 1991. It took another year before I was truly "on the bus" but this is a band that affected a lot of music fans' lives through four generations. There's no reason to dismiss that kind of power, even if you can't quite grasp why people liked them.

Though Garcia was in decline during my years seeing the band, he still was capable of passionate playing and soulful vocals, particularly on the ballads like "Stella Blue" and "Morning Dew." Their incredible ability to harness the energy inside an arena or stadium was something that you had to experience to truly understand. I'm proud to say my experiences seeing the Grateful Dead changed my life, and I know I'm not alone.

I just made the connection, Bob Wire.. as in "White Trash Paradise"
I might not have Jerry on my iPod but I do have American Piehole - love it

they set up the current business model for all these young bands focusing on live shows instead of album sales plus out of 3235 or so shows they let audience members tape them all so they have a coherent band history as for the singing rock music doesnt care how well a person sings its more an emotional thing and also the fact that one head will help out another head even if they are a complete stranger you never get that at any others shows maybe you should look at the business aspect of the band as well as all tthe recording innovations from anthem of the sun sessions do your research before you open your mouth

thanks for not getting the point by the way it's called punctuation you should check it out

Can't you understand why you would get so much backbash about this subject? You started off by dismissing the Grateful dead as nobody's with out doing any research. When you did this you dismissed the people who love them. What is your DEAL? :~)

Never a fan of their music but don't believe they were about "music," they were an event or better yet, a "happening" and music was a small part of this. For myself, Canned Heat far exceeded the Dead in talent but lacked the popularity. I do think their name alone, Grateful Dead...garners immediate attention, greatly contributing to their success. As for the Beatles, it wasn't only about their music but of much greater importance...what they did for music because their influence found its way into almost every genre.

Oh, I fully expected some backlash. But what I was hoping for (and I think I was pretty clear in the last line of the article, if you bothered to read it) that what I'm looking for is elucidation.
Thanks to the commenters who gave me some ideas about where to investigate the Dead's music and hopefully find out for myself what all the fuss is about.
I might wind up still not getting it; I'm not the first person who ever stated an indifference for the band. But feel free to vent, if that's what you need. Peace off.

Ok thanks, If you didn't get before I'm not sure if you will this time.

Mickey and Billy's percussion together in any SpaceJam was something far different than I had ever experienced in any other live show, and I still wax about the weird stuff they used and the other-worldly sounds and sensations that were procured for thine ears. Wow....but what does this have to do with Zappa anyway?

I don't know why, it's the same reason why you like some music and you don't like others. There's something about it that you like. Ultimately I don't find it's in my best interests to try and analyze it, since it's fundamentally emotional.
Jerry Garcia

I never saw the Dead live, and although I like many of their live recordings, because I am not an aficionado a lot of what I have was done in the studio. Yet, I still love the Dead, and I'm not sure I could tell you why.

... "Uniquely American" (as someone else said) might have something to do with it.

... Is it too much to draw a comparison to Tom Waits who, unlike the Dead, is unarguably innovative but equally unapproachable to a vast number of music listeners?

... Maybe a better comparison for period and genre would be Bob Dylan? His lyrics are great if you read them, but you can't tell what the shit he is mumbling half the time, yet I love Dylan too.

... hmmm, if you're not finding the illumination you are looking for here Bob, maybe it is because you haven't clearly articulated the source of your displeasure, or confusion. "I don't get it," as a basic premise is difficult to work with.

... though, then again, maybe "getting it" is all there is to any art, musical or otherwise.

... but I'll make you a deal, I won't blame you for the failings of your ear if don't blame me for the preferences of mine.

There are certainly many music fans who don't "get" the Grateful Dead. Their influence is astounding, however. Witness the fact that the people spend time blogging about whether they "get" the Dead; I've yet to stumble across a blog musing about Ted Nugent. Just sayin'.

Nearly 2,000 of their approximately 2,400 shows are accessible via internet. Many can be downloaded, all can be streamed.

Listen to "Weather Report Suite>Dark Star>Eyes of the World" from 3/28/73 - - all the way through. You ain't going to learn what you don't want to know.

There's not much you can really do about this now, but I'm not aware of anyone who blogs about whether Michael Jordan was any good at what he did while admitting they never saw him play. There are strong musical reasons why artists as diverse as Duane Allman, Bo Diddley, the Beach Boys, Bob Dylan and Ornette Coleman all sat in with the Dead. All of them make many people's top whatever lists. It's true the the "top x" of anything lists, especially in music, are so subjective and ultimately silly that they bear little discussion. What is not true, however, is the assertion that Garcia won't make anyone's "top 100 lists". In fact, in every such list of which I'm aware, Garcia is not only on it but near the top. So, one can dismiss the listing phenomenon and have good arguments for doing so, but please don't misrepresent what people are saying who actually compile those lists.

Finally, it's hard for anyone to compare to the Beatles because of their commercial heft and the lasting influence of their early period simple pop (what they made look easy seems terribly difficult for just about everyone else) and the complex pop they made later. In one major respect, however, the Beatles don't belong in the same conversation as the Dead - the Beatles sucked live and simply never dared the kind of improvisational rock that the Dead essentially invented. (No, they didn't invent improvisation, but they imported to rock a skill set common in jazz and blues before anyone else. And rather than quibble over "firsts", suffice it say they mastered it like no one else before or since. Few rock guitarts, quite frankly, had the improvisational skills that Garcia did.)

If you're genuinely curious, spend some quality time listening to second sets from Dead shows in '72, '73, '74 and '76.

You'll thank me later!

Cheers.

if you dont think the dead pioneered the music industry you are insane! ever hear of stereo sound? you obviously did not do any research for this piece at all

You know, in our 400 level sound class back in college, seems to me that the only sound system discussed was the Wall of Sound. Odd, isn't it, for a bunch of theatre techies to look at that and decide it was the ultimate sound system of it's period, travelling or fixed.

'bout that same time, Mr. Wire, while I was making m'self up as Hipshot in make-up class and readin' 'bout yer doin's in the comic pages, I was listening to Garcia break ground by playing banjo next to the best old time country and bluegrass people of the time. Put Old and In the Way on yer list, too.

Oh, and didn't the Fab Four credit the Dead with being one of their greatest influences? I read that in some book.

To misquote a great line from a bluegrass song
"And there never was a band like the Grateful Dead!"

I don’t think most of us are trying to vent here, but rather help people to enjoy some thing that we want to share the wealth with so to speak. It makes me sad when other folks don’t get it since I and so many like me enjoy it so much! Now I don’t want to ramble too much as I probably have enough passion about the subject to write a book about it –but there are already plenty of those, written by folks who are much more intimate with the band.

I just think a personal tidbit might shed some light on just how in to this band (and Phish, in my case) some of us are even when we have wide ranging tastes that appreciate many other musicians. As a Christian yet, not a catholic, I decided about 13 years ago that I should give up something for Lent each year, more meaningful than chocolate-So for 13 years now I’ve given up the Dead and Phish. So for 6 weeks each year I scrape and scrounge my music into the furthest nether regions of my closet LP, cassette (which I incidentally prefer-work much better on logging roads!) and CD collection and listen to;
Beatles
Rolling Stones
Hendrix
Clapton (Cream, Blind Faith)
Bob Dylan
Bob Marley
Led Zeppelin
Pink Floyd
Neil Diamond
Neil Young
Elton John
Johnny Cash
Willie Nelson
Dolly Parton
Porter Wagoner
Patsy Cline
Loretta Lynn
Moby
Matisyahu
Orb
Jane’s Addiction
Ozzy
Nirvana
Allman Brothers
Santana
Miles Davis
Primus
Zappa
David Bowie
Circle Jerks
Dead Kennedys
BeeGees
ABBA
Glen Campbell
SnoopDogg
String Cheese Incident
U2
Everly Brothers
Jean Pittney
ProculHarum
Aretha Franklin
James Brown
Moody Blues
Jefferson Airplane
CSN
And yes even on special occasions
The North Dakota Swing King himself…aka the Polish Polka Prince
Lawrence Welk
So my point being I think I am blessed to have an appreciation of a rather wide range of talented musicianship AND BY THE END OF LENT EVERY YEAR I AM BORED TO TEARS WITH ALL OF THEM!! For the rest of the year 97% of what I listen to is dead, Garcia band and Phish-and I’ve still only scratched the surface after 24 years and exposure to about 2000 of about 6000 available recorded hours.

Life is just not the same without the two bands that do it for me, and so many to such a degree. I end up wanting to quit skiing and road trips until Easter.
As for technical musicianship, as some one else posted Alembic, Bear the Wall of sound and essentially inventing basic stereo through the concept of mixing separate microphones for each musicians instrument, I do believe qualify as feats of musical pioneership or breaking ground! And oh yeah –you don’t need Lysergic Diethyl-amide to enjoy them –haven’t done any in eons and they still sound just as good or better!

Saw them once in Giant's Stadium, '94. Can't say I thought the show was all that great. Interestingly, there were many dedicated fans who I heard talking about, "...they're not playing any happy music. Why?" The opening act was Traffic, with Steve Winwood at the helm. They were awesome. A huge Low Spark of Highheeled Boys jam.

I think it's cool that so many people got so much enjoyment out of their Dead experiences. That's all that really matters in the end.

I saw the Dead live in Missoula in 1974, but I had to wait until my friend who was working the show checked out midway through and gave me a ticket stub. That meant I saw only half of a four-hour show. It was pretty good, but I never got into the Dead, either. The real bummer was, some unfortunate threw one of those glow-in-the-dark light sticks toward the stage and it hit Bob Weir right in the head. The whole band stopped, Weir walked up to the microphone and said, "Thanks, fuckhead." Kind of put a damper on things.

That said, do you ever listen to Garcia and Grisman? Even more than on the Old and In the Way stuff, Garcia shows his mastery of American folk music. Damn, what a sweet sound. And don't miss the time Grisman got Tony Rice and Garcia together for the first time. Tony Rice was the master of the lightning-fast bluegrass-meets-jazz runs, but then Garcia comes in with his slower but eminently soulful playing and the combination is pure bliss. I don't know if I have a favorite album, but I wonder if I've listened to anything as often as I have to "Not for Kids Only," which might be the first one by Grisman and Garcia. Somehow, even Garcia's creaky voice seems made for that style of music.

I do take issue with the folks who say that with the Dead, its not really about the music, but the experience and/or the scene. In my (humble) opinion, the experience is a big part of it, but the music always came first. The most dedicated Heads that I know have a pure love for the music first, and the experience is just icing on the cake.

Although the Dead had the capability to be absolutely horrible at times, most often they were great fun. And luckily for us devotees, there were moments – and even full shows – that were simply pure transcendent brillance.

And as fun as it could be, the scene ended up getting out of hand and becoming a big drain on the experience, with well-intentioned people who forgot their manners, mixed in with people who had no love for the music and/or never had any manners.

So, to sum up, for myself and many of my friends, it WAS the music, for without the music, none of the rest of it would have happened.

Ed Kemmick, Glow sticks were only really popular about 25 years ago (1984) and the patent were only first put in place 1973 and 74 by the navy. Your story is not really that believable. However, I do agree on Jerry stuff.

Hey what happened to Bob Wire? We haven't heard from him in awhile. I was Just wondering if you took any of the suggestion given. If so maybe you can give some feed back that is now based knowledge of the Grateful dead.

Thanks, Travis and Ed. I was there. I think, if I remember correctly, they opened with China Cat Sunflower. I get tingley just thinking about it. I believe it was a plastic kegger pitcher that the "fuckhead" threw. I can't remeber who it hit. But it did happen.

Oh, and only 3/4 of the Wall of Sound was wired for that show. You could hear every string on every guitar as crisply as if you were next to it. Their music is timeless.

Had Bach been born in 1948, he would have played keyboards for the Dead.

Adams Field House
May 14, 1974
Missoula,, MT US

Bertha
Me & My Uncle
Loser, B. T. Wind, Scarlet>
Roses
Jack Straw
Tennessee Jed
Deal
Big River
B. E. Women
Playin

U. S. Blues
El Paso, Row Jimmy
WRS Prelude>
WRS Part 1>
Let It Grow>
Dark Star>
China Doll
Promised
NFA>
GDTRFB

Thanks, Woodelf. The memory plays tricks, and my memories of 1974 are particularly untrustworthy. But we do seem to have established that somebody threw something that hit Bob Weir in the head. It would have made a great Kaimin headline: "Dead Head fuckhead hits Dead's Weir in head."

That Dead show is locally famous because I think it was the only one they ever played in Montana. I was living back East then, but somebody who lives here once told me it was some drunk cowboy pitching a beer bottle at Garcia. Anyway, they never came back. Just another story. Who knows?

Oh, and how you been, Ed? I still read City Lights online on Sunday.

I've been doing very well, thanks. It's amazing what a cessation of blogging will do for a person's physical and mental health.

Ed, Good. Me too. Still freelance hacking away in the wilds of Idaho. Maybe I'll try to get in touch, etc. I'm sure you miss my extraordinary and pithy conservative comments that used to grace your very-missed blog (Come on, Ed, bring it back). I can't remember those guys in Billings who hated my guts. No matter, I have new guys in Missoula and Boise who hate my guts. Anyway, glad to hear you still have a "newspaper job" (which is kind of like saying glad to hear you still have a "buggy whip manufacturing job"). Anyway, hope it, well, remains. Best wishes to you and yours, Ed. Good luck. And Addison Bragg, RIP. I know he wasn't working any more, but what good timing. The last of a breed. He must've had fun. Oh, and while we're at it: Jerry Garcia, RIP.

Dammit, Bob! I just wasted a chunk of time READING about BLOGGING about the Grateful Dead again. Fortunately I was listening to Harding Theater 11/07/71 (http://www.archive.org/details/gd71-11-07.prefm.kaplan.9570.sbeok.shnf) and had a really good time anyway.

Wow! How can so many people, even self-described "Deadheads", miss the MOST important point of ALL regarding the difference between experiencing a Dead show and going to see other bands?!?! How can they miss the MAIN reason that explains why, despite weak studio albums, inconsistent performances and struggling vocals, the GD were still in a class by themselves, an inspiration to the best musicians of their time, the seed that sprouted the entire "jamband" scene, and considered to be, not just "the best" at what they did, but "the only ones" that did what they did?

The reason why the GD were best experienced LIVE, why, engaging in transpersonal rituals, such as taking psychedelics, spinning, trading energy, or simply "being in the moment" were such an important part of the experience, why there was nothing like it anywhere else is because the PRIMARY intention of a GD show was NOT to entertain, it was to transport everybody in attendence to a higher level of consciousness.

This has been, and will FOREVER be, the true purpose of a Dead show. This truth is known and supported by all "old school family", but is perhaps best validated and explained by Phil Lesh himself, in his book, "Searching for the Sound." In this book, he states often that the purpose of a GD show was to "transport" us to a more enlightened level of awareness by creating an energy loop between the energy that flowed through the band, to the fans ("family"), and back again. The experience was intended to be spiritual in nature and depended on Deadheads and band members alike reflecting energy back to eachother, in a building loop that broke through "the Doors of Perception" (and often took us to Terrapin Station, or the like).

The vision of the Grateful Dead experience was born from and based on the acid tests. The idea was to create a sacred space where a synergy of energy could occur that transported EVERYbody (even those not consciously participating) to a higher level of consciousness, i.e. "enlightenment".

Even Joseph Campbell, noted mythologist that worried that organized religions were hurting people by forcing them to engage in "empty ritual" (and also helped to form the plot for the Star Wars series to be a modern "hero myth") declared, late in life, after experiencing a GD show that it was a spiritual experience akin to a Dionysian ritual from Greek times, and an example of "living ritual and myth" with complete and passionately engaged participation by the fans/Deadheads.

It's as simple as this: the intention of the Grateful Dead was to provide a catalyst for EVERYbody to engage in an energy ritual that would contribute to hightened awareness and spiritual transformation. THIS is why you can't explain "what the deal is with the GD" when you attempt to evaluate and compare them to other "normal" bands. This is also why they were able to produce a HUGE range of music based on multiple influences and, even then, allow those songs to grow and change to reflect current times.

This vision got corrupted in the late 80's and early 90's due to harsh mandatory minimums on small L busts that put people in jail for 30 years! Old "families" closed ranks, and the "new kids" coming on tour were swept up by dealers that easily used them by telling them a lie: that it was about the scene, about the deals, about how hard you could party. This was the infection that almost killed the vision, and killed Jerry for sure, since he felt responsible for all of the people modeling his worst traits (H addiction) and depressed because they chose to copy the shadow side of him instead of the inspired side.

Unfortunately, it took Jerry dying to shake off the riff-raff, the people that only came for the scene, or just came to be entertained. Just to be sure, "The Dead", in the recent tour made a point at every show to point out that the energy they created together was intended to inspire EVERYBODY there to PASS IT ON, to SHARE it, to Tithe it, to do their share.

The vision IS still alive, but I worry when I see threads like this.... the time is critical now for us to stop debating points that don't matter. What really matters is that you know that GD shows, just like life in general, were about the energy YOU put into them. Whatever you put in was reflected back 10 fold and this cycle happened over and over until miracles happened. Just like in life..... "the love you make is equal to the love you take".

Still Grateful, Turtle.

Oh dear, where to start with your assertions?

"...his guitar playing, while it has its moments, isn’t going t land him on any Top 100 lists"

You have obviously missed every credible top 100 guitarist list ever published. Yikes. What an assertion.

"The Dead, as far as I know, didn’t come up with any pioneering techniques in the studio."

Actually, they did, but you would need to have to have actually read some history of the band to discover that. Fact is, that the Band revolutionized sound techniques, especially live sound. Many of the main players in the PA industry had staff and roots in the Dead sound staff. Ever hear of Meyer Sound, one of the most successful sound companies on the tour circuit? Didn't think so.

"The Dead are capable songwriters, but nowhere near the transcendent, trail blazing work of the Beatles."

And exactly WHO ever made the assertion that the Dead's songwriting surpassed the Beatles? Like it is a contest? In that silly format, did ANYONE surpass the Beatles in songwriting. You're setting a pretty high bar there, Sparky.

"Deadheads rally ‘round the band’s message of peace, love and psycho-travel..."

Oh my god, now I AM getting annoyed. ;-)

"I’ve never seen them live, so that whole dimension is something I can’t comment on"

The Dead so much as admitted they never made a great record. They were a live band, a band that push the envelope live, not in the studio. This was very common knowledge.

....."the music doesn’t justify the lionization."

And the band (and blog journalism) was hardly a fitting subject for such a prep-school analysis of the music. But next time take a little more time to study the band's bio, history and yes, the music. There was something you are missing while dissing the music as little more than, "Jerry Garcia's reedy voice". There is more there when you peel back the layers of what you think is a stinky onion. It's sweet.

Bob,
This is just my opinion - I'm no historian, nor do I have the answers, I'm just a head who was there for a good bit of it, and has nothing but love for the memories - I've not read all the comments made above, as I don't have the time, and quite honestly, don't care too - opinions are like a-holes - everyone has one, and they all stink. So, if you'll indulge me, I'd like to add my thoughts to the stench and say this:

The Grateful Dead were a jug band originally - under a different name - Mother McCree's Uptown Jug Champions - playing jug blues / folk / country and what not - acoustic - then they started to play electric blues, which, with the times, and their personal interests, began to become 'high' blues or something along those lines. Being a Dead-Head or just a big fan, depends on who you speak to, I've racked up some hours/years listening to their music and seeing them in concerts - too many to mention here. The one thing I haven't heard anyone mention to you yet (perhaps they did, I didn't read everything above) is that they started out playing to people that didn't come deliberately to hear/see them - they came for the acid tests. The Dead just provided odd/weird/good music/acid soundtrack (sometimes awful from what I've heard) but that was what the acid tests were = an experiment on another level of consciousness. As they grew more popular, they realized that their groove was best suited for 'dance parties' - not your standard 'run through the set of the songs we know' type of thing. They would play really long versions if they were enjoying it and the crowd were liking it.

The concert is what is was all about - being alive and knowing it - pure and simple. You can analyze this all you want, and read all the stories about UFO's and crazy hallucinations and what-not, but it comes down to the fact that they knew what they were good at, and they mined it for all it was worth - some argue there's a never-ending amount of it out there to be had. And you just need a group willing to 'tune-in' to it.

What I came to understand was that it was about meeting your neighbor and shaking their hand in a co-existing manner that was just pure love of life. Why fold into the "go to school, get a job, get a wife/husband, have a kid or two, retire and die" mode of thinking. I'm sounding a bit hippie-esque here, but I think it suits the subject matter and more importantly - the times - this is the by-product of the rigid '50's and the reason most of the counter-culture came to exist. People wanting more out of life.

I listen to dead shows now on tape/cd and sometimes get the same sensation - "not that good of show, average at best" but it's not about the tape - when all is said and done, who cares about the tape? - it was about the good times inside the venue that occured in the moment - magic happens - and if you can provide a stage for that to occur, then sometimes you get lucky and it manifests itself for all to experience. This, I believe, is what the masses are after and why everyone 'goes ape-shit' over them - I know that's what I was after ( still am, haven't found it again - yet, and not for a lack of searching either) - no one else (band) has 'attempted' to conjur up this element. Garcia, in interviews, has even agreed saying that it's not something that they can control - it just happens when it happens - they just try to give it a chance to arrive.

To borrow from a Rolling Stone interview in '71 :

Reich: And the magic comes not just from you but from the whole thing.

JG: The whole thing. The unfortunate thing about the concert situation for us is the stage; and the audience has either a dance floor where they all sit down or seats where they all stand up. It's too inflexible to allow something new to emerge. lt's a box that we've been operating in, and we've been operating in it as a survival mechanism, yet hoping to get off when we can. But basically it's not set up to let us get off, and it's not set up for the audience to get off either. The reason is that anarchy and chaos are things that scare everybody, or scare a lot of the people--except for the people that get into it.

RS: Why doesn't it scare you?

JG: Because I've had enough experience with it to where I like it. It's where new stuff happens. I have never understood exactly why people get scared, but they do get scared for reasons, like to protect oneself, to protect one's own personal visions of oneself. They're all paranoid reasons. That's the thing you stimulate if you fight it. It's like any high-energy experience; if you fight it, it hurts; if you go with it, it's like surfing, it's like catching a big wave.

Reich: Do you think they don't believe in magic?

JG: I think that our audience definitely does. Or, rather than dwell on the idea of magic, they know that there's a certain phenomenon that can happen, and if they come to see us enough, they've observed it, they've seen it, they've been part of it. And that's the payoff. That's the reason to keep on doing it. We know that it can happen, and the problem has been in trying to figure out how can we make that happen and at the same time keep our whole scene together on a survival level. And that's essentially what we're doing .

Reich: Why is it important to get high? Why is it important to stay high? What good does it do anybody--the world, the community or people themselves?

JG: To get really high is to forget yourself. And to forget yourself is to see everything else. And to see everything else is to become an understanding molecule in evolution, a conscious tool of the universe. And I think every human being should be a conscious tool of the universe. That's why I think it's important to get high.

Reich: Getting zonked out or unconscious is a whole different thing.

JG: I'm not talking about unconsciousness or zonked out, I'm talking about being fully conscious. Also I'm not talking about the Grateful Dead as being an end in itself. I don't think of that highness as being an end in itself. I think of the Grateful Dead as being a crossroads or a pointer sign, and what we're pointing to is that there's a lot of universe available, that there's a whole lot of experience available over here. We're kinda like a signpost, and we're also pointing to danger, to difficulty, we're pointing to bummers. We're pointing to whatever there is, when we're on--when it's really happening.
--------------------------------



It was a great thing to be a part of while it lasted, and I truly hope I live long enough to see some other entity tap into that 'magic', or whatever it is. It has nothing to do with the tapes, it was always about being in the moment. " Be Here Now ; Now Be Here "

I hope you find it someday,Bob, some way. It is an awesome experience 'knowing' there is something larger out there waiting to be reborn.


" There were days... there were days... and there were days between. "

-=A

Pass Here and Go Forward - You're On The Road To Heaven

LMfriggin'AO...

When all of you finally come out of your LSD induced comas, feel free to join my group called "The Grateful Dead really SUCK" on Facebook! Full of "Dead Hippie", "Dead and HOPEFULLY Forever DEAD", and "Death to the Dead and all jam bands" jokes! There is even a joke from a quote from this page on there about "Oh Man" from the second post! Seems to me that if you have to take drugs to enjoy the music of a band, you are obviously trying to delete the fact that they may JUST suck!

You can put The Dead and Jerry Garcia on any Top 100 list that you'd like... fact is that they would've went down like an airplane with terrorists if it wasn't for the drugs! I'd rather have my brains bashed in at a Slayer concert! LMAO

I shake my head in shame to think that people can truly like this limp-wristed, smelly, unwashed, watered-down, dreadlocked, untalented noise that the remaining members of "The Grateful Dead" won't let die like Jerry! I'd rather hear 2 monkeys pumping a football! LOL

Shawn, NOT of the Dead

Why don't you just take your ball and go home.

Truly... For someone to go to the bother of actually having enough time and mis-spent passion to set up sophmoric anti-Grateful Dead pages, it says a few things: A) I'm unemployable B) I am 12 years old C) I am a narcissist. All of the above, perhaps?

OK.... I knew that the insults would come, so this is not a big "shocker" to me, but I'll respond!

swank: I don't like monkeys! LMAO

To tdub...
A) I own my own business (and have for 5 years straight), and also work full time for the U.S. Postal Service... (it's true what they say about employees going "postal") LOL

B) I'm more than 3 times the 12 year old age... and with age came wisdom, and it made me see things a lot more clearly! Some of the bands that I thought were great in the 80's, I now see as terrible (including The Dead)! Of course, I saw The Dead as a farcical promenade even in the 80's!

C) Narcissist: 1. self-centeredness, smugness, egocentrism...
If this is what you mean, then damn right! I live in a country where I can like and dis-like whatever music that I chose... And (as long as Obama doesn't ban this...) I have a right to speak my mind about whatever inane bands that I choose! I like being smug!

D) Isn't it supposed to be in the "Handbook For The Dead Fans" that you're supposed to spread love and not hate? I believe that the love that you're supposed to be spreading is for EVERYONE and not just the ones who "get it"... Maybe you're not in step with your Dead-Head brothers and sisters...

For whomever may share my thoughts about this "dead" generation... we've got some cool "Death to The Dead" t-shirts coming soon to the Facebook page! They'll be cheap and hopefully we can end the facade of these wasted lives together! LOL

Your opinions matter and you have the right to them, and the right to voice them. You can like and dislike whatever you want.

Folks just don't appreciate when you generalize about a whole group of people, and the phenomenon they obviously care deeply about. Esp. when you obviously know little about the subject and when you do it with hateful, obnoxious speech.

You don't need to insult others in a misguided a attempt to make your opinions count more.

Also, FYI, the members of the Dead were known for being notoriously NON outspoken on politics, etc. Their fans may have been peacniks, hell, the band may have been a bunch of liberal peaceniks, but Jerry and crew were loath to try to spread any philosophy or politics.

swank: Point well made! I'm not a political person either! I say let's impeach that idiot that we have as a prez IMMEDIATELY! Bring a real American into office! (Whomever that may be!)

I'll make an attempt tomorrow to only insult the ones who piss me off! I never said that ALL Dead-Heads were idiots! Just some! OK, well maybe I did... Sorry!

I'll still be happy when this whole movement drops the 60's and gets with the "here and now"... That "trip" has been done and gone for decades now...

"I say let's impeach that idiot that we have as a prez IMMEDIATELY! Bring a real American into office!"

I think this pretty much sums up who we are dealing with here. Someone who missed the "glory days" of the eight Bush years, an avowed narcissist, which would explain a lot of the misreprentations and outright cluelessness about the band and their fans, not to mention the rest of the world in general. I know, it's a bitch being that 20% of the people utterly out of step with the rest of the country-and bitter about it.

Last post. Better stuff to do than banter with the politically, socially and morally deaf.

I never said a word about loving or liking Bush (the ex-prez, of course, not the furry loving creature between... nevermind). Why did this turn political anyways? I just hate The Dead and their followers... oops! Sorry swank! CORRECTION: SOME OF THEIR FOLLOWERS!

tdub? Could you be as clueless to not admit that 90% of the followers are just unwashed, burnouts that won't move on to something better because their too scared to face reality? There are a few responses on here that actually say in short, "if you take some drugs, the music is better"... I believe that that says alot about the "followers"...

just never "got" the whole Dead thing... Not a political statement! just my beliefs!

Hell, if you look at what a real Communist government is, and how it runs... and not the whole "Nazi style Communist" government, I say lets look to that form... THAT my friend, is a political statement! Let our country support itself, and triple tax any country shipping in the crap that they make in all these foreign countries! I know that these are MY OWN political ideas, and not what the "popular" ways of thinking are, but I'm a realist! Now that I got my political statements out of the way, I'll continue on bashing The Dead, thank you!

My little group on Facebook has started growing, and growing! Seems that my ideas are not exactly such a bad one... People from 17 to 60 seem to think that the whole Dead thing is idiotic too! BUT, these are MY ideas, and the few of the group who admit it!

last political statement.... When are you finally going to admit that Obama was a mistake?

Ok, I am taking the bait!

"Why did this turn political anyways?"

Uh, I believe it was when YOU made the political statement at the outset?

"Could you be as clueless to not admit that 90% of the followers are just unwashed, burnouts"

See, you are are dead (oops) wrong again! You are making blanket statements that "because hair is long" and they are "dirty hippies" that they are uneducated, while in FACT, there are more college eductated Deadheads than the vast majority of other band followers. It's simply a fact and you CAN look it up. I know, I know, never let the facts get in the way of your "truth". Now, your cue to slam college educated people.

I am perfectly happy and not insulted that you hate the Dead. Fact of life. People love them or hate them. It is just your strange obsession in hating them with such vigor that stymies me. Many of us would be curious on what music you do love, so we can at least get a fair basis on what constitues great music to you?

"Hell, if you look at what a real Communist government is, and how it runs... and not the whole "Nazi style Communist" government, I say lets look to that form... THAT my friend, is a political statement!"

Well, yes it is, in all of its unfocused, unsubstantiated, paranoid glory.

"My little group on Facebook has started growing, and growing!"

Looked it up. 68 whopping members. Impressive. Keep workin' it, man, it may get up to a hundred by the end of the year.

"last political statement.... When are you finally going to admit that Obama was a mistake?"

Oh, I guess when we wait another 7 1/2 years and we can see if Obamas 60% approval rate (and nearly 80% approval rate around the world) will sink to Bush's ALL-TIME approval low of ANY president in history. Now there's quite a goal to aspire to.

Ah well, I don't care if your political beliefs are xenophobic and that your form of political (and musical) discourse is akin to what pro wrestling is to "professional sports".

The world really isn't as hateful, spiteful and mean spirited as the world you seem to be immersed in. And that ain't "hippie peace and love", talk.

It's called reality.

' Can't talk to you without talking to me, because we're Guilty of the same old thing - Thinking a lot about less and less, and forgeting the love that we bring. '

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' Comes a time when the blind man takes your hand and says: "Don't you see? You gotta make it somehow on the dreams you still believe." '

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' Different strokes, for different folks. We gotta live together - everyday people. '

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' Will it go round in circles? '

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' The theme from the bottom is the theme from the top. '

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' Any fool can get complex, it takes a genius to attain simplicity. '

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' We always did feel the same, we just saw it from a different point of view. '

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' He who walk forward while looking backward hit tree. '

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' They've got the guns, but we've got the numbers. '

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' Q - When a deadhead comes to stay at your house, where do you hide your money? A - Under the soap. '

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' If you can't laugh at yourself, you shouldn't be pointing fingers. '

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' If you can't eat it, don't serve it '

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' Don't use cannon to kill mosquito. '

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' Man who stand on corner with hands in pockets feeling cocky all day. '

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' Ring around the rosey, pockets full of poseys, ashes, ashes - we all fall down. '

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At some point you must ask yourself if the trophy is worth the frustration of the game? Who's deciding the victor? And what difference will it make in the end?

:^)

I would agree with you about the Beatles (I'm pretty sure the Dead would agree with you about the Beatles).

I'm 54 years old, so I got into them pretty early, in the late '60s, with the release of "Live Dead."

Let me tell you just a little bit of what I dig about the Dead:

1) They have the same musical tastes that I have, which is American roots music (blues, bluegrass, jug band, ragtime, jazz), all of which I was into as a pre-teen (my big sister was what we called a "folkie"), even before I became a rock 'n' roll fan. This is true of most musical acts of the '60s and '70s. Whereas a band today might list its influences as, say, Led Zeppelin or Eric Clapton, Led Zepplin and Clapton's influences were Howlin' Wolf, Muddy Waters, Lightnin' Hopkins, etc ...

2) They play this kind of music, with their own particular and sometimes psychedelic, spin, very well. They are masterful musicians. I disagree when you say that Jerry Garcia isn't one of the top rock guitar players of his generation. I think he may be the most underrated. Not because he's "the best," a meaningless category, but because he is unique, which is the real mark of a musician. Put 100 well-known guitar players in a room and have them play a few bars. There will be instances where you will mistake Clapton for Beck or Page for B.B. King, or Stevie Ray Vaughn for Hendrix. Garcia will be unmistakable. He never, ever, sounds like anyone but Jerry Garcia. He couldn't help it if he tried. Acoustic or electric, equipment set up this way or that way, he will always sound like himself. There are many reasons for this, but one of the big ones is that unlike som many of his contemporaries, Garcia tended to play melodically, with the notes outlining the chord changes, like a jazz player. Rock guitarists tend to rely on a collection of modal riffs. Don't even get me started on Bob Weir, an even more underrated guitar player. No one -- and I mean no one -- has a more distinctive style than Weir. And that includes Garcia. Phil is an amazing bass player who plays it like a lead instrument. Bill the Drummer does what a drummer is supposed to do in a rock band, and does it very well. I've always preferred the Dead with a one-drummer set up, but Mickey is an excellent, creative drummer.

3) I love their attitude. I can't get really tired sometimes of the "dangerous" or "cynical" pose struck by so many rock bands, many of them contemporaries of the Dead. The Dead were about having fun, eternal optimists. What do rock bands have to be cynical about? They live charmed lives. The Dead really did seem "grateful" for their fans.

4) Garcia-Hunter, Weir-Barlow, were/are wonderful songwriting teams with a wonderful sense of musical history and the folk tradition (this is again a manifestation of their roots music background). Songs like "Stackalee" and "Candyman" are based on traditional tunes have been around since at least the turn of the 20th century, and every roots musician had their own version of them with different melodies and lyrics. I think it's really cool that the Dead plugged into that tradition. The Dead do or at least were at their strongest, I think, with "story songs" featuring Americana of all sorts, like cowboys and gamblers and painted women.

5) I love the Dead's acid-jazz, for lack of a better word. There's nothing stranger than to hear them move from a song like Dark Star into a swampy blues.

6) They took chances on stage. With the Dead, the fun isn't so much where they go but how they got there.

I love the Grateful Dead as musical artists, but I kind of hate the lemming-like Dead Head scene.

You can still learn to appreciate the Grateful Dead...even if you didn't see them live while tripping on LSD. In fact, by the time I saw them (1982) they were well past their peak, which most people consider to have been 1977. In some ways, their legacy would be better if Jerry Garcia had died at the end of 1977.

They were innovators for sure: Wall of Sound, instrumentation, genre bending etc. I love the free form improvisatory electric music (acid blues/rock/jazz) that they created (listen to 1977's Wharf Rat...Morning Dew...Franklin's Tower on Dick's Picks #3).

I also like their country folk acoustic side. Which can be found on the studio albums such as American Beauty.

The Grateful Dead were weird American originals and Jerry Gracia was a guitar genius. Again, I don't really like the tie-dyed fans...they're kind of boring.

this is the funniest shit i have read since the miraculous mutha advice column in mid-70s easyriders magazine. Tell me.... Did weir make up all these letters or does he have a writing team?

Thanks everyone for your input. I never really liked the grateful dead before, I was more into pink floyd back in the 90's, and I had a chance to jam out with my hippie friends but never understood what the hype was all about. this past summer I had the opportunity to work the Rothbury festival in Rothbury MI, and was totally blessed to have seen The Dead live for the first time and I was astonished not only by the music, but the environment. It completely changed my ideas of the band. the band played for about 8 hours and I absolutely LOVED every minute of it. I felt so blessed to have had such an eye opening experience(and this was without drugs)in my lifetime and at the same time wished I would have found out earlier (would have loved to see Jerry) in my more free days when I could actually travel around to see the band. I probably would have been a deadhead! I have been searching for a good DVD to watch until I hear of any tours, if that will ever happen again. hopefully so.