IS ANYBODY SURPRISED?
Molloy’s Wolf Ruling: Just Another Chapter in the Neverending Story
No wonder the wolf debate has become the story that just keeps going, great for journalists but nobody else.By Bill Schneider, 8-11-10
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| Photo by John and Karen Hollingsworth, U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service. | |
If anybody is surprised U.S. District Judge Donald Molloy put the gray wolf back on the endangered species list and stopped wolf hunting in Idaho and Montana, he or she hasn’t been following the debate. I’m sure not surprised, but his decision, released Aug. 5, puts the spotlight back on a lot interesting issues.
Here are my thoughts on the next chapter of the biggest outdoor story of the century.
Wolves Don’t Recognize State Lines. I have a hard time blaming the judge or those evil eastern wolf-lovers for the endless mess we’re mired in. Instead, I tend to blame the wildlife agencies, state and federal, for even thinking the Endangered Species Act (ESA) allowed delisting based on state lines--artificial, nonscientific, political boundaries meaning nothing to wolves.
It’s true that the ESA doesn’t say anything about “state line delisting”: It doesn’t say agencies can’t delist based on state lines, but I have to believe most judges would take the safe route when the law is so vague on such a key point.
Delisting should be based on science, not state lines. Even the Fish and Wildlife Service (FWS) said so in the past, but later retracted it when the political winds changed.
So, please don’t be angry or dismayed at Judge Molloy’s ruling. The die was cast two or three years ago when agencies made a political decision to leave Wyoming behind and abandon their original plan calling for recovery in three official recovery zones (Greater Yellowstone, Central Idaho and Northern Montana) and go for piecemeal delisting based on political boundaries.
To be fair, I suppose the agencies had little choice. It was more like an act of desperation. Politicians were breathing down their necks to move ahead with delisting, and the numbers supported it. Using even conservative figures, the wolf population recovered years ago.
But Wyoming was clearly not going to be a team player and yield to pressure to write an acceptable management plan. This more or less forced agencies down this ill-fated path, so let’s not pretend we’re shocked by the outcome.
Nor should we be surprised when Wyoming stays the course. The politicos down in the Cowboy State won’t bow to pressure from other states or the feds. Instead, Wyoming will remain focused on its lawsuit against the FWS, choosing to believe the state will eventually prevail and get approval for its current plan where wolves can be shot on sight everywhere except in and near the national parks, but that seems like more dreaming.
So get used to it. For at least a year, if not years, the wolf will remain on the endangered species list...unless, of course, Idaho and Montana convince the plaintiffs (12 conservation groups) to drop their lawsuit. More on that later.
Wyoming, the Best Friend a Wolf Lover Ever Had. Thanks to those immovable cowboys down in Wyoming, wolf lovers might realize their pipe dream--the gray wolf restored to much of its historic range, not just in the three recovery zones as originally planned.
We already have wolf populations in Oregon and Washington, and perhaps Utah, with the big prize--Colorado and Rocky Mountain National Park, with its massive elk population--coming soon.
On tap--eastern Montana’s Missouri Breaks, South Dakota’s Black Hills and North Dakota’s Theodore Roosevelt National Park, and a lot of newly established wolf habitat in between.
All thanks to Wyoming.
Don’t Worry, Lots of Wolves Will Continue to Die. People tend to think that with the wolf back under ESA protection, the population could grow exponentially and wipe out big game and domestic livestock operations. Not.
Federal and state agencies will continue to kill a lot of wolves, just as they did before the first-ever hunting seasons in 2009. Since reintroduction, in fact, 1,258 wolves have been “removed from the population” by agency “control actions.” That figure doesn’t include legal hunting. You can see the zone-by-zone, year-by-year numbers here.
In 2009, for example, Idaho and Montana hunters bagged 260 wolves, but “control actions” claimed 270 more. This approximate, if not increased, level of mortality will continue in 2010 and beyond until the issue is resolved.
Both hunting and control actions result in dead wolves, but there’s one big difference. Hunters pay agencies to kill wolves; all of us pay agencies (with federal tax dollars) to kill wolves.
Greens, Don’t Push Too Hard. Right now, wolf-loving conservationists obviously have the momentum, but they should tread softly. Their continued success has a big downside.
Sooner or later, the frustration with the endless litigation could cause Congress to gut the most powerful environmental law of the land, the Endangered Species Act.
Witness this statement in the press release sent out last week by the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation:
“When federal statutes and judges actually endorse the annihilation of big game herds, livestock, rural and sporting lifestyles--and possibly even compromise human safety--then clearly the Endangered Species Act as currently written has major flaws,” said David Allen, RMEF president and CEO. “We have already begun contacting the Congressional delegations of Idaho, Montana and Wyoming to ask for an immediate review of this travesty--and reform of the legislation that enabled it.”
Plus, Sen. Max Baucus (D-MT) has already announced that he wants Congress to “intervene.” I’m not sure what he means, but do we want find out?
These shots over the bow should give pro-wolfers a wake-up call. All those who loathe the ESA have been salivating for decades for a chance to open it up and “improve” it. Let’s hope pro-wolf groups don’t hand them the opportunity on a golden platter. Stringing out the wolf controversy for much longer will do exactly that.
We Can Work This Out. In the past, I’ve offered up a plan (click here) that could end the wolf debate, and now, albeit years late, it appears as if something like it might happen. Finally, people have actually been talking about talking. “Settlement talks” were scheduled for Aug. 18, but were abruptly canceled after Molloy’s decision came out.
I tried to find out more about these talks, mainly trying to confirm if they’ve been re-scheduled and who would be at the table. After making a half-dozen calls, it’s obvious nobody wants to give out much detail.
Here’s what I did find out. The Montana Department of Fish, Wildlife and Parks (FWP) has taken the lead and invited key stakeholders to the table--and deserves kudos for doing it, in my opinion. Representatives from the FWS, FWP, the Idaho Department of Fish and Game and at least one representative for the plaintiffs, probably an attorney for Earthjustice, were due to meet Aug. 18 in Helena. After Molloy’s ruling hit the Internet, Idaho wildlife officials were so angry they canceled the meeting, which seems quite strange. You’d think Idaho would be even more anxious to settle this after the defendants lost big in District Court. Right now, FWP is trying to reschedule the meeting.
Notably, representatives from Wyoming were not planning on attending the meeting, so even if all other stakeholders came to agreement, they’d still have to overcome Wyoming’s refusal to write an acceptable management plan.
With the exception of the Wyoming roadblock, achieving a “settlement” seems fairly easy. Anti-wolfers need to accept the fact that there will be more wolves than they’d like to see running around, dining on a few elk backstraps and top sirloins and making a few dogs disappear. Pro-wolfers have to accept the fact that hundreds of wolves will be killed every year and that the big dog’s range will be limited to roughly what we have today, not extended into California and Kansas. The point is, there’s plenty of room in the middle for agreement.
Like managers and union reps resolving a labor dispute, stakeholders, preferably including Wyoming, need to lock themselves in a room and not come out without an agreement. I bet they wouldn’t lose a single night’s sleep.
Interestingly, though, there’s also the possibility of an agreement without Wyoming in the game. If Idaho, Montana and the FWS could alter their management plans to make them acceptable to the plaintiffs, which would likely involve maintaining higher population levels than currently called for, the plaintiffs could withdraw the litigation and allow delisting to proceed in Idaho and Montana. Since Molloy’s decision is being appealed to the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals, such an agreement would probably have to happen as part of that process and would put extreme pressure on Wyoming. Those cowboys would be looking at many years of federal management while Idaho and Montana took back state control. They’d hate that, believe me.
Everybody wants the wolf off the endangered species list, so everybody can claim it as a big victory. So, let’s do it, soon, and get the wolf issue out of the courts, at least in Idaho and Montana.
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Comments
Do you really believe that if Wyoming were to bend over and let the enviros write the laws that the enviro groups would sign an iron clad agreement not to file any more suits unless and until the wolf numbers fell below the 30/300? Are you or anyone else naive enough to believe they would not break such an agreement immediately.
The whole thing is a money making and power grabbing situation. It is time to put the environmental groups as a whole on an even footing with the rest of us and force them to put up the cash for damages, no more of the BS that an animal is too consumed to declare it is a wolf kill just because there is no extremely damaged tissue left.
Can you name one single compromise the environmental groups have made to say nothing of any part of the original agreement that they have honored? Only total capitulation is acceptable to them and of course they will decide how much more blood they want from us as time goes on. Allowing anyone this kind of power with NO responsibility nor accountabilty whatsoever is extremely dangerous.
The wolf issue is about urban ideas of how a world they are not a part of is managed for their benefit, mostly out of guilt and the need to escape their urban environs. That their food and sustenance comes from all that non urban area is not of importance to them. But it sure as hell is to the people who live in the rural areas of our country. Wolf imposition is detrimental to their economic welfare. Pure and simple. Wolves do and will kill, and sometimes eat, livestock and pets, plus a whole lot of the prey base as the wolf population soars and falls, depending on out migration and depletion of local prey species or recovered prey species after wolves have left to greener pastures. The idea of a roving hit squad of predators to keep the "balance" of nature is not really to the liking of states with low population and a large dependence on agriculture. Why are they steam rolled on this deal? How is this wolf introduction not a travesty of the urban majority power to inflict economic pain on rural America? The tyrannical urban majority is real. Win in four urban areas in Montana, and you win the statewide election. Win Portland, Corvallis, and Eugene, and you win Oregon. Several elections in Oregon in the last decade, the Portland vote was the winning majority. The candidate lost in every county but Multnomah, and the margin in Multnomah county was 100,000 votes, which negates a 55-45 state wide majority every where else. The Tyranny of the Urban Majority, and the foundation for wolf protection, lawsuits, money for NGOs to access the EAJA. Pretty simple deal, really. Wolves are an urban idea foisted on a rural economy. Wyoming just happens to be more rural, and less urban, than most states. I would bet a wolf infestation in North Dakota would find similar obstacles to those Wyoming has presented. The emerging wolf population in Oregon will be protected by Portland, for Portland, and all the hate will express itself to Portland in the legislature, all to no avail. Our best hope is that the forces who now believe wolf introduction into the Mt. St Helens volcano reserve succeed, and after they run through the thousand or so easy elk, they will begin to predate livestock way close to town. That will take out some suburban legislators of the liberal bent once pets go down a wolf maw.
Utah and Colorado are of the same demographic construct as Oregon and Washington. Big, sprawling urban areas, and vast areas of wild in between. All wolves have to do in Utah to get the bum's rush is begin to take livestock off the Dessert Ranches. In Colorado, turn the hunting economy on its backside and then start in on the livestock and ranchette lifestyle. Most of all, I would like wolves working over the wildlands of California. Wolves, and grizzlies. The Golden Bear state needs its bears back. Totally protected like elsewhere. You cannot do a thing about the one eating your horse, your cow or goat. It is your duty as a rural resident to feed the urban voter's wildlife. That state has little adverse feelings, right now, to cougars consuming people, so adding in a few bears would be acceptable. And, having extirpated their iconic apex predator long ago (but Cal is the still "the Golden Bears" and UCLA "the Bruins), nowhere is the need for apex predator reintroduction more needed than California. Like, their identity has been lost. Even USC, the Trojans, are now tarnished. California needs something to give them their unique identity back, and what better than obstinate grizzly bears??
The wolf issue is not about wolves, but about how the rural population is manipulated in legislatures and the Congress, because candidates that promote social issues take vast sums of money from environmental interests, and are indebted to them. It is possible to have a moderate social agenda and a rural economic agenda. That the lines have been blurred by anthropomorphism and favorable tax laws for NGOs is apparent. Never the less, it is about who gets elected, using whose money. It appears Wyoming has not been appropriated by NGO money and Eastern swells and fops doing "good" while supported by the family trust.
Your ending is completely wrong. "Everybody" does not want the wolf delisted. Not a single plaintiff organization in the lawsuit wants their fundraising foil taken from them.
Everybody ELSE wants them delisted.
Well urban america, pray that your toddler isn't the first to go.
I am sure happy there has not been a breeding pair of velociraptors found somewhere. Then again perhaps an introduction of them to the urban areas just might result in a reality check. NAH....we will just tie that up in ESA litigation too.
"Using even conservative figures, the wolf population recovered years ago. "
then later,
"Delisting should be based on science"
Well which is it? The population recovered years ago, you wish for science, yet you just can't get enough of them wolves.
I like the California plan. Allow volunteers to humanely trap as many wolves and grizz as they can, and reintroduce them to California where they can be protected. Look what the deal is with cats there. After CA gets it sorted out we'll have a pretty good idea how we should handle it in the intermountain west.
I live in a city named Boise too, velociraptor man, where's the "very rural" one?
Do wolves recognize country lines? Do the ones living in Canada have a cute little "'eh?" at the ends of their howls?
We live in divisive times and we are supposed to become more divided with each passing day. As the environmentalists have shown us by their action there is no such thing, as compromise the environmentalists will honor. Since the environmentalists don't stand on their word the agricultural community should be within their rights to shoot, shovel and shut up.
I am a wildlife photographer and their is no bigger thrill that I get than photographing grizzlies and wolves but my neighbors have had their cattle eaten and another had his 8 year old dog killed on its chain at home. I want my neighbors to stay in business. A friend with a wheat farm doesn't let his teenagers go into the barnyard any longer with out a gun as wolves have often been seen by the home. They no longer feel safe in their own home - It is a shame to feel your children are safe at home then lose that.
Environmentalists you want us to hate you more just keep screwing your neighbor out of their financial security and personal safety.
Yellowstone is the worst neighbor anyone could have. What we have seen done there in the last 10 years goes against the conscience of anyone and everyone who loves Wildlife.
I do agree that it is time to go by the original plan and keep the wolves in the park. They will soon extirpate them with the einvironmentally perfect management. They are well on the way, of course if they had bothered to study the old reports of wolves killed they would have realized that 56 adults and 80 pups were killed total in the 42 years that they were eliminating them. And they cannot understand why double that number cannot exist on a constant basis without destroying everything else.
Perhaps he should put on his cowboy hat, some boots and wonder incognito to any Saturday night team roping event from Preston, ID. to Missoula. MT and mention wolves and see what kind of response he gets. He will find the coversations I've had over the past two weeks to be exactly as I stated.
Now maybe those cowboys were just blowing smoke, but I know some of them were not. If you don't want to stir up the natives don't write about wolves.
And, yes coyote attacks are starting to happen in urban America and so will wolf attacks as they are forced to move about to new hunting grounds that might take them close to towns and cities.
http://articles.latimes.com/2010/jul/20/nation/la-na-ny-coyotes-20100720
Coyote attacks alarm New York suburb
Reporting from Rye, N.Y. — The attacker pounced from behind a large rock as 3-year-old Erika Attar played outside her home. "Mommy!" shrieked a playmate as the girl struggled to break free. Erika's father dashed across the yard, and the startled predator vanished into the dusk......On June 29, the Tuesday after the first attack, two coyotes dashed across a sidewalk and leapt on Emily Hodulik, 6, as she played outside her home.
http://www.ocregister.com/news/city-257887-coyotes-coyote.html
Shooting coyotes is the latest tactic in a long war between Yorba Linda and its coyotes, which have been seen this spring walking around neighborhoods in the daytime, entering homes and garages and attacking pets inside, and lunging at small children in backyards.
Most of us know the wolf "I told you so story is not to far off."
Please provide access information to the "Jim Beers expose" to which you referred.
Whistle blower who caught USFWS stealing funds from Pittman/Robertson Excise Tax to import Wolves illegally into U.S. from Canada. Ed Bangs balls deep in this Criminal Enterprise as is Defenders of Wildlife......oh what a tangled web we weave when Destroying Wildlife is based on Greed !
1. 90,000 Elk killed by Wolves in the last 10 years, Yellowstone is empty.
2. 28,000 Mexicans killed in an effort to get "Pot" to the markets in USA. I don't smoke pot and am Anti-Wolf, most pot smokers are Pro- Wolf.
3. Abortion ? Most Wolf Lovers are Baby Haters.....who exactly are they saving the Wilderness for ? They have no children and will have no children.....this one fact alone renders them null and void, they are not contributing anything to the Future but their misguided opinions.
All humans are not the problem, if we could get rid of Liberals for 25 years America would be a better place!!
And please stop with the coyote attack stories. How many human deaths due to all predators would you say occur each year in the U.S.? 2? 3? A 2002 study by The Norwegian Institute for Nature Research estimated that in the 20th century there were 20 to 30 wolf attacks on humans; 3 were fatal -- all due to rabies. There are 2 documented fatal attacks by coyotes on record. In the U.S. 16 - 18 people per YEAR die from domestic dog attacks. The Dept. of Transportation estimates that about 130 people a year are killed by collisions with white-tailed deer in the U.S. And somewhere around 30,000 people are killed each year in the U.S. from gunshot wounds. So get real and spare us the hysteria and hype. Stop blaming wolves (and other predators) for our destructive habits. Also please stop with the ridiculous claims about "wolf-lovers" being baby haters. I love wolves and babies (and have 2 kids).
Wolves belong on the earth whether you like the hunting competition or not.
Try to search the records for the number of wolves killed inside of Yellowstone during the years they were killed and a bounty paid. The only records I can find indicate a total of 56 adults and 80 pups spread over I believe 36 years.
We have far, far more than that now, and far fewer elk remaining. Pay attention to the fact that not only are the prey species in trouble, but some of the wolves are mangy and skinny. It is appearing as though the shortage of food is impacting the bears as well as the elk and moose. Interesting the park where wolves have total protection is the one place with dropping numbers and sick animals.
On the other hand the state with the "worst" plan according to enviros is the place that increased numbers overall including making up for the losses inside Yellowstone where they have a whole pack of their own biologists, none of who can seem to recognize the symptoms of an over population.
Yellowstone Park now looks like LA , 3.5 Million people and NO WILDLIFE. 3.5 Million people leave a hell of a Carbon Foot Print, not to mention the sewage......I have never relieved myself in Yellowstone but Wolf Lovers can't say that , can they. Respect or lack of Respect is something you can't hide either you have it or you don't.
The fact that you have two children(I find that when someone uses the word "Kids" , they really don't have children) but avoid talking about Abortion, really display the lack of respect that allows them, with a clear conscience to leave Human Waste in Yellowstone.
Wolves belong on Earth, they belong in Canada and Alaska and Russia anywhere they can't be victimized by Liberals, 28,000 Dead Mexicans don't lie, 90,000 Dead Elk can't lie and all the Aborted will never get to lie !
"Over Populated" with non-producing , spoiled brats !
Do tell us more. The Fish and Wildlife Service reneged on the plan they helped write, and that they endorsed? Arbitrarily, or did they provide some reason?
By "caving," and thereby being able to have wolf hunting, ID's wildlife populations suffered more? Innuendo only goes so far.
Tell us one place where the enviros have given even a centimeter, much less actually tried to work with folks. Power and money is what drives them and that is all they care about.
The suffering folks of the 3 states (and every other state with wolves) have kept our word many times over, but it is never enough for the enviros, nothing short of humans being killed is going to satisfy them. It will of course be our fault because we didn't provide enough food for them.
Not making sense. And when you, or anyone else pulls out this "demon enviros" card, I tune you right out, same as if someone were to work demon ranchers b.s.
As to your question about "one place," the Owyhee Canyonlands is certainly such a place where compromise was reached between radically different camps.
This comment thread has plenty of invective and railing at stereotypes going nowhere. It needs more information, not more one-sided opinion.
I have friends on both sides of the issue, and an open mind about it, myself. That's why I appreciate Schneider's article and comments that provide useful history or information. "It's all their fault" is neither informative nor persuasive, regardless of which "they" you're talking about.
In 2000 there were 19,500 Elk in the N Yellowstone Elk Herd , today 2,200 . Three years ago there were 17,500 in Jackson (I saw them ). All the interior Elk are also gone ( these are the Elk that winter inside the Park, never going out either end). Cody, Dubois, Gardiner, Salmon ,Lolo ETC. Elk gone.
Stereo types run both directions Tom. To cling to "Open Mindedness" in the face of such damning evidence only makes those who do look delusional.
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By hotels comparison, 8-15-10
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Today's Idaho Statesman had a "Reader's View" opinion piece by Mike Clark, Executive Director of the Greater Yellowstone Coalition:
A realistic plan to move past the polarization
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/08/15/1303459/a-realistic-plan-to-move-past.html
Does he fairly characterize "Wyoming's plan" as allowing wolves only in national parks and wilderness?
Idaho F&G;'s recent report showed significant regional variation, but overall nothing like the 10:1 reduction cited above. (I'm not sure if that was intended as demonstrative, or a particular example?)
I also imagine that his "let's start from the populations there are now" approach isn't acceptable to many commenters here? Extirpation still seems to be an attractive option for some.
My sense is that people with rabid obsessions are considerably more dangerous than wild animals, and I generally avoid them like the plague. Keeping an open mind while learning the facts about something is not "clinging," thank you.
Once one "knows" the facts and has decided the evidence is damning, all evidence fitting the pattern will stand out and any contrary evidence will be discounted, deprecated, or simply invisible. It's called "cognitive dissonance," check it out.
It is past time to get judges, lawyers, and litigants out of wildlife management as well as single species biologists. We need biologists who are looking at the whole picture, not jsut one species. Our moose are in big trouble in Yellowstoen and the Tetons where wolf populations are very high. The recent bear attack by skinny grizzlies may be the hand writing on the wall that predictions of the impact of 300 wolves may not be pertinent to 6-10 times that many wolves. The whole situation needs to be evaluated by general biologists, not jsut bear or wolf biologists.
Single species management is not a good way to manage wildlife and when you add lawyers and judges for big money "non profits", we have hit on just about the worst way to manage it.
My sense is that people with rabid obsessions are considerably more dangerous than wild animals, and I generally avoid them like the plague. Keeping an open mind while learning the facts about something is not "clinging," thank you......Oh but it is because you are rowing desperatly up "Denial " in a boat called "Open Mind" !
SaveWesternWildlife.org is a NON-Profit ! Not a NON- Profiteer ! Dedicated to the preservation of Western Wildlife and The Cowboy Way . We ride horses , we don't drive BMW's...we are the true Defenders of Wildlife !!!
One aspect that makes the wolf debate so intractable is the arrogant, selfish , unscientific ( read: downright ignorant) hopelessly shallow beief that big game herds exist for the prime benefit of the hunting public, and all other uses for big game must get in line behind that and anything that subtracts wildlife from an " Available to Be Killed By Hominids " spreadsheet is negative and must be quashed.
They are not your elk , nor mine. They are ours but really belong to nobody. Same goes for wolves ( and grizzly and cougar and black bear , even coyotes and the mesopredators). There is no god given or man-driven right to a constant supply of easily available elk and deer for annual " put and take" sport hunting. Big Game is not a farm crop; big game herds are not a well stocked store for trophy hunters to practice their blood sport in acts of gross consumerism.
I used to be a hunter and a guide, but got disgusted with the practicioners, especially the crowd that does it for money and ego. I still support the meat hunter and the private resident who hunts for the experience knowing he is not guaranteed a big animal in his crosshairs. I cannot support this flavor of Manifest Destiny that decries wolves as being a negative force in wildlife conservation and ecological management. Anyone who espouses that belief or practices it is not qualified to be at the table where the fate of wolves and the future of wildlife management is the topic. You/they are NOT the ' true defenders of wildlife'. Far from it. We never save anything by killing it.
P.S. Don't get me going on the " Cowboy Way".
Would that apply to those who haul in wolves to kill off all of the prey sepcies? Yellowstone itself is a monument to the results of the loving management of environmentalists who favor predators above all else.
The elk and moose in the park are disappearing like the aspen leaves in an October wind storm, but the wolf lovers try to blame the drought that is causing an increase in elk in non wolf infested areas. It simply cannot be the effect of "never enough predators" driven environmental policies. Those mane infected wolves are a shining star in the environmental crown of management, and now skinny bears may be adding diamonds to it. You may be in favor of all of the state's wildlife being in the same boat as the Yellowstone elk and moose, but the rest of us have a different opinion, it was fine before the great wolf plant.
It would be interesting to know if those who knew you as a guide/hunter have the same wonderful opinion of you that you do yourself, thinking everyone except you is bad.
Please read what I write, not what you think I said. Don't make stuff up and then claim I said so. You are really bad about projecting your beliefs onto other folks' opinions like really bad vacation slide shows...aaarrrggghhh.
And you have your facts wrong, as usual.
's ass about wildlife.
I believe that the SWW individual in this case is one Tom J. Fross http://www.freecoyote.com/Home_Page.html
Let me take a stab a the "Cowboy Way", Dewey you have never hunted or been a guide. So, unfortunately in order to even start to be a Cowboy you have to be Honest , you Fail !
The Wildlife in the State that, that Wildlife finds itself standing is in fact the Property of that State ( any Guide knows this ), So yes your disease ridden Wolf is in fact killing MY ELK !!!
TJ FROSS CO-FOUNDER "SAVE WESTERN WILDLIFE" ..."We ride horses not Mountain Bikes , We are Biodegradable " !!!
Wolves and Grizz have not been living together for thousands of years in Yellowstone. they have been in Yellowstone together for 15 years, to be exact ......and it isn't even the right Wolf . So in fact these two should not have run into each other ever !
TJ Fross Co Founder "SaveWesternWildlife" ....We wear Wool and leather, no spandex here boy's , We are Biodegradible !
http://billingsgazette.com/news/state-and-regional/montana/article_676719a0-9e6b-11df-948b-001cc4c002e0.html
"I guess you're not a cowboy either".....after 90,000 Dead Elk we've figured out YOU"RE no good at guessing !
TJ Fross co Founder SaveWesternWildlife
"ARE YOU REALLY GREEN OR JUST OBSCENE " ?
Which brings me to another point: Elk hunting is different now. Wolves have been reintroduced into the mix, and they hunt 24/7/365. You are going to have to accept the fact that wolves are entitled to elk but you and your ilk are merely privileged to them. They are not YOUR elk , but they might be the wolves' elk. The elk are not there for your convenience, profit, blood sport, or any other definition of " taking", and you do not own them nor have a right to them that supersedes the needs of wildlife. Wolves eat elk. Get over it. Wolves will eventually produce a finer elk herd, but that herd is not a " farm crop" put there for the taking by human hunters. Not at all.
Wolves will make you a better hunter. If you can't accept the challenge and the competition , then don't hunt elk. There are plenty of elk for man and wolf, except now you actually have to hunt harder and better. Can you do that , Todd? Can you hunt ?
I was in the elk and sheep hunting camps for 20 years, by the way , until I got disgusted with the outfitting business, the practitioners but especially the egotistic clientele. You'all would have a much higher success ratio for those modern elk hunts if you didn't spew so much testosterone into the autumn breezes of the high country... or these web pages.
Is there equal opportunity killing for wolf bitches? Title IX for their sport killing?
Who will deliver WIC, Food Stamps, housing assistance, to needy wolves? Is there universal health care for wolves, partially financed by the interest overcharges the new official college loan provider for higher education, Obama the Loan Shark? I wonder how all those kids applying for college loans feel about paying 4% in interest just to finance universal health care, and then the interest needed to repay borrowed money?
Will the non profits and religious left find homes for orphaned wolves and provide foster homes for the ones whose youth is misspent and wasted? All those misunderstood livestock killers need is to be shown that there is a better way. And a good attorney, at public expense, of course.
What we really need to do is find a way to use their innate skills to better the planet. How about wolves trained to seek out and kill feral cats? Save a lot of birds, and keep a lot of humans and rodents from getting brain parasites. Evidently the Cat Lady does not go crazy and acquire cats, but one cat can leave just a little bit of poop somewhere in or outside the house for the Cat Lady to touch, and she gets the brain parasite, which induces a form of schizophrenia that allows her to become the Crazed Cat Lady we see with the house full of cat feces and cats. The cats did that to her. With wolves directed at cats, we can save the Cat Ladies of the World from cat poop parasites. Or at least all those old maids or dateless babes who fall into the cat lover demographic. Use those wolves for societal benefit and the environment will improve because of a quantum reduction in feral domestic house cats. We already know that cat poop parasites from storm water runoff in Southern California have limited sea otter habitat, so with SoCal wolves culling cats, sea otters can regain former territory and access Pismo clam habitat..eat some sea urchins, some mitten crabs....win win..holistic approach to ecosystem repair. And make sure the government supported wolf social worker drives an electric car. Lives in a house with a one gallon flush and solar heating. The possibilities are endless.
Watching Vids produced by Defenders of Wildlife has the same effect on me.... it's a Pro - Anti reaction thing.400,000 hits in 3 days is not the measure of a bad video even by your standards.
In the year 2000 there were 19,500 Elk in the N Elk herd by 2003 it had been reduced to 9,450. Last winter Bill Hoppe who is a real Guide and Outfitter and lives right across from the arch at Gardiner ,Mont counted 2,200 Elk. I was with Scott in Jackson Hole last spring, the count was 4,200, three years ago the count was 17,500. Of the 4,200 Elk on the feed ground 2,500 never leave Jackson.....that leaves 1,700 to go back up into the Death Zone !Now it has been discovered that the EIS were all wrong..What ? Bull Elk are actually being killed at a much higher rate than first thought leaving many unbred cow Elk . So with this bit of Knowledge you can esimate how many Calves have been killed ( unbred counts as a set of twins) since the Wolf was introduced ......and the Winner is 90,000 of My Elk have been eaten by YOUR Wolf and you haven't paid a Dime for one meal .( Estimates include Idaho)
A BIGGER QUESTION DEWEY, "CAN YOU COUNT'?
The Wildlife in a State is the Property of that State !!!Yellowstone has been feeding their Wolf our Elk and giving us E-Granulosus, isn't that special ?
TJ Fross Co Founder SaveWesterWildlife " Are you really Green or just Obscene " ?
TJ Fross Co-Founder SaveWesternWildlife
"ARE YOU REALLY GREEN OR JUST AN IDIOT " ???
What's that noise ? It sounds like a house of cards falling down !......don't it Dewey ?
TJ Fross Co Founder "SaveWesternWildlife"
"Today Idaho, tomorrow Montana "!!
That sound you heard was not a house of cards. Cranial flatulence blowing back in your face , maybe. " SaveWesternWildlife.org" is Esperanto for " Let's go kill something, Bubba..."
Now if you'll excuse me I have an election to monitor , and Cooke City all day tomorrow.
TJ Fross Co Founder SaveWesternWildlife
" Wolfers without Borders " !
http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/cms/news/fg_news/10/aug.pdf
Plenty of data, didn't see where anyone said anything about "proved." But thanks for dropping by to confuse things for us. Their measurements showed 23 of 29 management units with female elk numbers within or above target, and 6 (including Lolo) below.
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