Bob Wire Has a Point (It's Under His Cowboy Hat)
Tucson: Will Palin Man Up?
In the midst of tragedy, an opportunity to ramp down the gun-themed rhetoric.By Bob Wire, 1-10-11
 |
|
 | |
| "I promise to tone down the firearms imagery in my next campaign. By the way, I'd like you to meet my running mate for 2012." | |
|
How many “troubled,” “unstable” and/or “unbalanced” loners are sitting in their moldy little studio apartments right this minute, having their blood boiled by the hatred and bile spewed by Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter, Sarah Palin and the whole Fox News cadre, while compulsively cleaning and fondling their oily semi-automatic weapons, waiting for their moment to get their names on CNN, BBC, and the New York Times front page, above the fold? Hundreds? Thousands? Hundreds of thousands?
Who knows? But all they need is a push, and there are plenty of high-profile media blowhards who are willing to supply it. Saturday’s murder of six innocent people, the wounding of a dozen others, and the near-assassination of Rep. Gabrielle Giffords, is tragic and grim. I would also say it’s shocking, but in the way that it’s shocking when you get repeatedly stung by angry wasps after jamming a long crowbar into their nest and stirring it around.
Mrs. Palin has had her minions working overtime, scrubbin’ her infamous “target” map from her websites even before the smell of cordite had drifted away from the shooting scene in Tucson. Palin, whose affection for firearms makes Charlton Heston look like Mohandas Gandhi, had proudly posted a map of the U.S. on her Facebook page, with twenty gunsight crosshairs scattered across it. These, she said, targeted the House Democrats who voted for the Health Care Bill. Below the map appeared a helpful list of the names of these Congressional members. (Bear in mind, Palin currently holds no public office. She is merely a celebrity, and a marketing tool for the Republican Party. Emphasis on tool.) “Don’t retreat, reload!” She crowed.
The ex-Governor had gone so far afield that she seemed utterly oblivious to the ghastly, thinly-veiled violence this map represented. Giffords herself expressed it best: “The way that she has it depicted has the crosshairs of a gunsight over our district,” she said, “When people do that, they have got to realize there are consequences to that action.”
And now Giffords lies in a hospital bed, fighting for her life. Hey, Sarah? Enough already with the guns. You love guns! We get it! But a lot of us don’t, and your ham-handed, shoot-em-up rhetoric has worn thin. Will Palin ever get it? Hell, why start now? Later, after the midterm elections, she tweeted her followers with this glowing proclamation of runaway success: “Remember months ago ‘bullseye’ icon used 2 target the 20 Obamacare-lovin’ incumbent seats? We won 18 out of 20 (90% success rate; T’aint bad).”
I won’t even address her wildly incorrect misuse of the word “taint,” but I am encouraged that she can evidently do simple arithmetic. Big improvement from her days on the Presidential campaign trail, when she wondered if “four out of three Americans have a hard time with fractions.”
Now, in the foamy wake of Palin’s furious backpedaling, we get this weak-ass explanation from her media aide Rebecca Mansour: “We never, ever, intended it to be gunsights. It’s a surveyor’s symbol.” Riiiiight. And that semi-auto used to mow down 20 people at Giffords’ gathering Saturday? What was that, an NRA Voting Lever? And the bullets that took six lives? Was that a Freedom Fusillade fired from a Hand to God Handgun? How much unmitigated bovine excrement do you think we Americans are willing to swallow, lady? I mean, not counting what’s mixed in with our Big Macs.
The level of hate among Palin’s followers is stunning. One commenter on her Facebook page had this to say after the shootings: “19 more districts to go.” Yes, really. I’m not trying to suggest that Sarah Palin directly gave the order to Jared Loughner to go down to the Safeway and take out Gabrielle Giffords. That’s ridiculous. It’s highly doubtful that she had his phone number. [Journalism 101 caveat: At this writing, it hasn’t been confirmed that Giffords was indeed a political target, although it seems likely.]
The point is, Palin and her flag-wrapped, specious media brethren have to answer to a certain amount of culpability in their role in this tragedy. The country is squirming with angry bulls, and she and Glenn Beck and other right wing cartoons are on the airwaves and internet 24/7, waving red capes all over the place.
Here’s another shining example: take a look at the Tea Party wingnut who lost the election to Giffords in Arizona last November. Jesse Kelly, ultra-gung-ho ex-Marine wanted to be your “Warrior In Washington.” He posed in his camo fatigues, spreading his legs wide and brandishing some badass weaponry, which apparently was supposed to reassure us that he knew his way around the hallowed halls of Congress. If that was his message, he should have been brandishing stacks of Benjamins and cases of Makers Mark, and wearing a pager with a hooker’s phone number in it. Hoo-rah!
“Get on Target for Victory in November. Help remove Gabrielle Giffords from office. Shoot a fully automatic M16 with Jesse Kelly,” said the ads run by this misguided jarhead. Don’t get me wrong, I have nothing but respect for the people who enlist in the armed forces to defend the U.S. But when they jump ship after their minimum commitment and then start whoring out their military experience as some kind of marketing scheme in a gun-themed election campaign, well, I’ll just say that this son of a heavily-decorated career Marine aviator finds it offensive.
Another loser, Nevada Tea Party candidate Sharron Angle, who was defeated by Harry Reid, called for supporters to take “Second Amendment remedies” to settle their disagreements with the government. Basically, she’s saying, don’t pick up a ballot. Pick up a gun. And Tea Partiers wonder why people characterize them as batshit crazy.
The post-massacre media outcry for civility and a cooling-off of the increasingly heated rhetoric from both ends of the political spectrum is as predictable as it is pointless. Am I guilty of calling Palin and Kelly and Angle power-hungry miscreants with warm Malt-O-Meal where their brains should be? You bet. But I’m not exhorting anyone to “target” them or “pick them off” or “take Second Amendment remedies.” I want people like them to tone that shit down. Fomenting violence and murder, even indirectly, is diametrically opposed to everything this country stands for.
Thanks to the First Amendment (yes, they’re ranked in order of importance, so go sit down, Second Amendment), you have the freedom to say what you want in this country. But if you think that includes whipping up the crazies out on the margins into picking up arms rather than participating in the democratic process, then you don’t deserve to enjoy the freedoms offered by this great nation. If you can’t dial back the hatred and violent imagery of your ideology, then you’re not one of us. You don’t deserve to call yourself an American.
Bob’s Maximum Honky Tonk Website
Join the Bob Wire Appreciation Society
Stumble It!
Like this story? Get more! Sign up for our free newsletters.
Comments
Rhetoric like Beck’s “constitution hanging by a thread,” Nugent’s “suck on this” referring to the automatic weapon in his law-breaking grip, and Palin’s crosshair map are indicative of The Right’s commitment to the destruction of the Democratic Party. http://www.democracynow.org/2011/1/10/chip_berlet_on_the_becking_of
Loughner had a hundred rounds with him likely visualizing the white horse prophesy to which Glenn Beck refers in the LDS-based sermons to his minions that air in his parents’ household. http://interested-party.blogspot.com/2010/10/this-npr-story-stopped-me-right-in.html
It is with some synchronicity that ip detects a mounting propensity for violence among those experiencing real or perceived political disenfranchisement.
Hinting that Palin, conservatives, the Right, etc, triggered this without a shred of proof is blatant McCarthyism. The hypocrisy asserting the non-existent connection without including self reflection is laughable: http://www.verumserum.com/?p=13647
During the 2008 election it was Obama who said in Philly: “If they bring a knife to the fight, we bring a gun, because from what I understand, folks in Philly like a good brawl. I’ve seen Eagles fans.”
Poisonous political rhetoric goes back quite a while. Adams and Jefferson threw some very pointed verbal darts at each other, and they were friends!
A person bent on a showy, public, horrific act of slaughter doesn’t need a verbal tap on the knee to trigger the reflex. It builds over time from many experiences that mix together into a living nightmare. Jared Loughner is nothing more than Travis Bickle.
The Left’s Paul Krugmans are not prophets or even wise men, they are merely Rahm Emmanuel opportunists salivating over a crisis. http://www.verumserum.com/?p=20406
(1) Evidence that Loughner was probably a democrat:
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/jared-lee-loughner-suspected-gabrielle-giffords-shooter-school/story?id=12575278
"According to court documents released today, authorities discovered a safe in Loughner's home with a thank you letter from Giffords for attending a Congress on Your Corner event in 2007 -- the same kind of event Loughner allegedly assaulted Saturday."
Strong evidence that Loughner was a disgruntled democrat nut. No conservative, tea party, or republican literature found in his safe. No evidence found that he attended republican or tea party political events.
(2) No evidence of from his friends that Loughner listened to talk radio or FOX News. No evidence from his friends that he was a tea party advocate. Plenty of evidence he listened to heavy metal music and smoked dope, both cultural influences of the left.
(3) The strongest evidence that Loughner was a leftist nut is his own YouTube channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/Classitup10
Note the flag burning video with Satanic music and lyrics. Flag burning and anti-Christian sentiments are indicative of the left. Right wingers don't burn flags. Note the interest in leftist reading material such as "Mein Kampf" and "The Communist Manifesto".
Every time I have presumed some such act of cowardly assassination was due to the actions of some hill billy redneck who would be affected by somebody like Glen Beck or Sarah Palin, it has invariably turned out to be somebody like Oswald, Sirhan Sirhan--or some other nonentity whose dedication to the Right wing turned out to be, at least, very questionable.
May as well face it, I think.
The propensity toward murderous insanity seems not to be focused on any particular political ideals.
Thanks for reading.
===quote===
When Clay Duke walked into a Florida school board meeting last month and attempted to shoot several people, Paul Krugman said nothing. A cynic might suggest this was because Duke’s Facebook page contained a rant about “the rich” and a list of his favorite progressive websites, including Media Matters. But Saturday, after a gunman opened fire on a crowd at Arizona Congresswoman Giffords’ public appearance at a supermarket, Krugman leapt to his keyboard to tell us who was to blame...
===end quote===
What happened in Tuscon is, like any other nut shooting, absolutely criminal, inexcusable. Had I been there, I hope I would have run to the sound of the guns, armed or more likely not.
A Congresswoman, a federal judge, a 9 year old kid getting a civics lesson, and four other upstanding Americans who deserved better? A travesty...what is WRONG with us?
But you are wrong in your approach. It turns out that the only "rhetoric" this guy heard was the voices in his head....from no less than the Washington Post:
“There is, at this point, no evidence that the suspect in Saturday's shootings that left six dead and Giffords and 13 others wounded was influenced by inflammatory political rhetoric, or that any voices that motivated him were outside his own head.”
Robert Barnes, staff writer for the Washington Post.
Other sources are saying the guy was also in the mental health system but had not been adjudicated or sequestered. Why the heck not?
So, to solve all the problems, my main girl Carolyn McCarthy is going to revive the assault weapons ban even if this guy had a plain old Glock, and she's also gonna trot out a magazine ban.
Trouble there is, one of his magazines jammed, and it would not surprise me if it was the EXTENDED mag....they are generally notoriously unreliable -- seems to me that it might be more effective to ENCOURAGE big magazines that jam.
One thing this fiasco is doing, is showing how profoundly biased and utterly incompetent the mainstream media is, and how opportunistic certain politicians of a certain party -- and their enablers -- tend to be. So....every cloud has a silver lining.
Do you people really think its OK for people to die for your ideas????
Basically if you think that guns are God, then you ain't one.
Put it in perspective, your six year old was gunned down by someone who thought their ideas were better than yours. What now????
I guess when you can learn to accept different ideas and cope then you might grow up to be a mature citizen in this world.
If you remain stuck in the 'I like my guns' or 'your not from my tribe' or 'you don't think like me' then your doomed to repeat this crap over and over. Go on, spread the hate!!!
OR
you could join the rest of the world, which doesn't think its superior to everyone else, but tries to help everyone about them to achieve something better. (This includes the majority of Americans who just don't need this crap).
Just think about your ideas and think about what someone, from Iraq, Afghanistan, St Louis, Tibet, etc. would say in answer to them???
People are responsible for their own actions. Nobody to blame here but the deranged nut himself.
Don't tell me the issue of violence in politics does not travel with all parties. You see it all the time.
However, never let the fact get in the way if you can bash your presumed enemies with lies.
Posted at 5:28 PM ET, 01/10/2011
Jared Lee Loughner was a registered independent, didn't vote in 2010 election
By Chris Cillizza
Suspected Tucson gunman Jared Lee Loughner registered as an independent voter in Arizona in the fall of 2006, according to the Pima County Registrar of Voters.
Loughner registered to vote on Sept. 29, 2006, identifying himself as an independent. Records show he voted in the 2006 and 2008 elections but is current listed as "inactive" on the state's voter roles -- meaning that he did not vote in November.
Again, neither right nor left matters. Crazy as a bedbug.
How about we all tone it down a notch.
Now, are young people who don’t vote more attuned to pop culture influences (violent video games, movies, hip hop lyrics, and literature) or political pundits?
Why does the Left avoid the OBVIOUS influences in his life and latch onto the specious other than to score political points in the manner of Rahm Emmanuel’s advice to never let a crisis go to waste?
BTW, Barbara Walters defended Palin.
Jack Shafer at Slate has it right: http://www.slate.com/id/2280616/
===quote===
For as long as I’ve been alive, crosshairs and bull’s-eyes have been an accepted part of the graphical lexicon when it comes to political debates. Such “inflammatory” words as targeting, attacking, destroying, blasting, crushing, burying, knee-capping, and others have similarly guided political thought and action. Not once have the use of these images or words tempted me or anybody else I know to kill. I’ve listened to, read—and even written!—vicious attacks on government without reaching for my gun. I’ve even gotten angry, for goodness’ sake, without coming close to assassinating a politician or a judge.
From what I can tell, I’m not an outlier. Only the tiniest handful of people—most of whom are already behind bars, in psychiatric institutions, or on psycho-meds—can be driven to kill by political whispers or shouts. Asking us to forever hold our tongues lest we awake their deeper demons infantilizes and neuters us and makes politicians no safer.
===end quote===
Violence is engendered, fostered, foment, and encouraged by the right because they KNOW that it's an effective tool! Repeat. Violence is an effective too to achieve their ends! Heck, they've even SAID as much at redstate! They are glad it happened! Why? Why is this an effective tool? Easy answer. Violence causes the government to become unworkable. And then, WHO benefits when the government becomes unworkable? Well the powerful do! And then, might makes right. Well, ask yourself who has the might!
The ONLY thing that amazes me is how depraved you righties really are in your defense of hate. That's sickening. And it's evil I might add. So, go ahead and keep watering the tree of liberty with nine year old girls and see how much sympathy you gain. I believe that America is ready to reject the hatred of the racists, haters, and dimwits.
BTW, thanks for the gratuitous insult which adds nothing to the discussion.
You see, the right has only grown more insane since that time. You discredit yourself mightily by defending the violent rhetoric. That makes you complicit. So, how much more blood/water does that liberty tree need from nine year olds? Just curious.
Seems to me that statements like "don't retreat, reload" (from Palin) and "Get on Target for Victory in November. Help remove Gabrielle Giffords from office. Shoot a fully automatic M16 with Jesse Kelly." (from Jesse Kelly) to a disturbed and unbalanced individual like Loughner is akin to saying "jump" to the disturbed guy out on the ledge. Shame on the political party machine that accepts such rhetoric from people they promote as leaders!
The vitriolic dialog from the other side also could equally as well have been part of the push that got this guy out on the ledge in the first place. The repeated rhetoric of Barack Obama, Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi, to name just a few to vilify the party that they oppose and create a chasm of anger and hate between the parties also clearly helps create an atmosphere of hate and conflict. Perhaps Dupnik (although I think in his position he was way out of line to say many of the things he did) held a measure of truth when he said "To try to inflame the public on a daily basis 24 hours a day, seven days a week has impact on people, especially who are unbalanced personalities to begin with."
It may well be time for the grassroots folks within all political parties to replace those kind of irresponsible and hate-mongering "leaders" with honest and well-meaning citizens who can agree or disagree while still remaining rational and respectful citizens. In the process it might also be possible to eliminate some of the greed and corruption that has also become a hallmark of today's politics.
Look it up!
BTW, Obama also alluded to Republicans as being enemies just last year: He said: 'If Latinos sit out the election instead of saying, "We’re going to punish our enemies and we’re gonna reward our friends who stand with us on issues that are important to us," if they don’t see that kind of upsurge in voting in this election, then I think it’s going to be harder, and that’s why I think it’s so important that people focus on voting on November 2.'
And your knowledge of history is pitiful. Remember the Civil War bullets vs ballots? Republican Lincoln, the South seceded? Bullets flew because of ballots cast for a Republican.
Something else....Poguester, your handle rang a bell so I thought I would elucidate the others with a little Wikigooglefoo:
"Pogue" frequently describes those who don't have to undergo the stresses that the infantry does, and is generally used as a diminutive for any non-infantry personnel who disagrees or impedes the wants of a "grunt".
Originally, the term was a sexual insult in early twentieth century gay culture, as "pogue" was slang for a young male who submitted to sexual advances.[3] This led to the related term "pogey bait", meaning candy or sweets.
Another source to which the term is attributed is the Gaelic and Irish language phrase "póg mo thóin" pronounced [pog muh hon] (literally 'kiss my arse'), applied to sycophants, suck-ups and others engaging in behaviors or practices commonly viewed by their peers to be beneath the expected degree of military bearing."
Hmmm. Pog my heinie? Indeed. If you act THAT out, PM, please don't tell us about it.
Each and everyone of who tolerates such things from the leaders of either party is complicit.
Try and remember, we are all Americans first and members of a political party second.
Pogue Mahone
Again I ask, why does the Left avoid the OBVIOUS influences in Loughner's life and latch onto the specious other than to score political points in the manner of Rahm Emmanuel’s advice to never let a crisis go to waste? See above.
The how can you offer assurances that he was influenced by anything at all?
The shooter was 22 years old.
Others observed that he was a drug and alcohol abuser.
He scared the sh*t out of people so much that he was banned from his CC.
Both he and his parents were loners.
He liked to read.
He was a registered independent and didn’t vote in 2010.
As to being anti-government, one of his favorite books was the Communist Manifesto. Not exactly laudatory of non-socialist goverments with the proletariat leading the revolution!
Now CONNECT THE DOTS, are young people who don’t vote more attuned to pop culture influences (VIOLENT video games, movies, hip hop lyrics, and literature) or political pundits?
Why does the Left avoid the OBVIOUS influences in his life and latch onto the specious other than to score political points in the manner of Rahm Emmanuel’s advice to never let a crisis go to waste?
Why do you insist that hearsay is so obvious?
Perhaps you should wait for the entire story. It will emerge soon enough.
Could it be that you want than to score political points in the manner of Rahm Emmanuel’s advice to never let a crisis go to waste?
BTW he also admired Fahrenheit 451 and Mein Kampf. What is so OBVIOUS about those?
Not much really.
The Left's argument continues to morph: http://www.verumserum.com/?p=20495
===quote===
Mark Halperin: Conservatives Accused of Incitement to Mass Murder Should “Turn the Other Cheek”
John on January 11, 2011 at 3:24 pm
We’ve finally found a liberal who wants to remove the wall between church and state: (see link for video- cm)
The coverage of this story has gone from murder, to blame without facts, to fake but accurate–now the first sighting of the next stage: criticism of the right-wing backlash. How dare these conservatives take offense at being accused of murder. They should act more like Jesus so that we can get on with acting more like Pilate.
What is truth?
===end quote===
In the run-up to 2010’s heated midterm elections, Arizona Democrat Gabrielle Giffords was placedon Sarah Palin's "target map," released in March, which featured gun crosshairs superimposed over her target's districts on a United States map. The graphic was removed from Palin’s website today. Palin has released a statement, saying her “sincere condolences are offered to the family of Rep. Gabrielle Giffords and the other victims of today's tragic shooting in Arizona.”
Photos: Gabrielle Giffords
Giffords' Republican opponent in the race, Jesse Kelly, whom she narrowly defeated, held a campaign event in which he invited supporters to shoot a machine gun. “Get on target for victory,” an ad for the event read. “Help remove Gabrielle Giffords from office. Shoot a fully a automatic M16 with Jesse Kelly,” the ad continued.
As Giffords’ father rushed to the hospital after his daughter was shot, the New York Post asked him if his daughter had any enemies. “Yeah,” he said. “The whole Tea Party.” He continued: "They always get threat[ened]. We don’t really have any information. The police department was supposed to call us but they didn’t."
http://news.yahoo.com/s/dailybeast/11742_gabriellegiffordsteapartytarget
The thing that struck me is, her hands are all wrong.
Furthermore, I saw Palin's poor gun handling skills on that hunt show, she's right handed. That AR in the picture is left handed, which while made, is a rare iteration. Never mind that a right-handed person would not hold any rifle that direction.
Gosh, I just love the blatant visual dishonesty. And I have to laugh at the incompetence of the graphic "artist," who clearly doesn't know the first thing about firearms.
You would think out in the blogosphere there would be ONE image of Palin actually holding a gun that could be abused? No....SOMEONE just decided to make stuff up AND got it wrong.
And you wonder why "people are so mean?" A logger buddy of mine hit it on the head the other day -- "It's not civil to lie to people."
As for that tree of liberty stuff....let's just say that most of us hold that idea in reserve -- deep storage reserve.
Let me humbly further point out that Jefferson said patriots AND tyrants, and that the tree of liberty only gets nourishment from the right "water."
Quite simply, neither Giffords nor any of the other victims came a million miles from meeting the criteria of "tyrant," and Slickhead Loughner sure as he// didn't meet the "patriot" standard.
So, even if you can't figure it out, some of us do understand know the difference between nourishment and poison.
The reaction to the shooting rippled across the country as Americans were aghast at the sight of such a violent attack on a sitting member of Congress. The shooting cast a pall over the Capitol as politicians of all stripes denounced the shooting as a horrific and senseless act of violence. What the Main Stream Media is trying not to talk about is the fact that U.S. District Judge John Roll was killed in the shooting. Judge Roll became notorious in Arizona after he ruled in favor of a group of non-citizen, illegal border-crossing Mexicans who were caught by Arizona Rancher Roger Barnett, in 2004, as they tried to sneak into this country and were caught on the Rancher's land.
Many in Arizona hail Rancher Roger Barnett as a “Patriot”, an “American Hero, but the amnesty crowd quickly labeled him a racist for holding these criminals at gunpoint. Soon, the liberal amnesty crowd took up the cause of the illegal’s, saying that their "rights" were violated by the man defending his land and his country by pointing a gun at the border jumpers.
The lawsuit is based on a March 7, 2004, incident in a dry wash on the 22,000-acre ranch Barret owns, when he approached a group of illegal immigrants while carrying a gun and accompanied by a large dog.
Attorneys for the illegal’s – five women and 11 men who were trying to cross illegally into the United States – have accused Mr. Barnett of holding the group captive at gunpoint, threatening to turn his dog loose on them and saying he would shoot anyone who tried to escape. That was a no-no, even though it is legal. In Arizona, he could have blasted them ALL and it would have been his legal right to do so.
But this is the new America, where Americans are "the enemy."
The illegal’s [leftists call them "immigrants"] are being represented by the Mexican American Legal Defense and Educational Fund (MALDEF), which also charged that Sheriff Dever did nothing to prevent Mr. Barnett from holding their clients at “gunpoint, yelling obscenities at them and kicking one of the illegal alien women.”
In the lawsuit, MALDEF said Mr. Barnett approached the group as the illegal immigrants moved through his property, and that he was carrying a pistol and threatening them in English and Spanish. At one point, it said, Mr. Barnett’s dog barked at several of the women and he yelled at them in Spanish, “My dog is hungry and he’s hungry for ass.”
The lawsuit said he then called his wife and told her to call the Border Patrol. Two Border Patrol agents arrived at the site, and retrieved the illegal’s. The illegal’s with the help of the MALDEF, promptly filed law suits against the Rancher. [Don't ask me how]
U.S. DISTRICT JUDGE JOHN ROLL WAS KILLED
In March 2004, U.S. District Judge John Roll rejected a motion by Mr. Barnett to have the charges dropped, ruling there was sufficient evidence to allow the matter to be presented to a jury. The Judge by this ruling implied that illegal immigrants have certain legal protections even after illegally crossing the border AND doing so while illegally trespassing on a private American citizen's property. Mr. Barnett’s attorney, David Hardy, had argued that illegal immigrants did not have the same rights as U.S. citizens.
This is noteworthy because Arizona law allows the use of physical and even deadly force to prevent the commission of certain serious crimes, and also allows for a person to use physical force against another when and to the extent that a “reasonable person” would believe it necessary to prevent criminal trespass on their premises, or to prevent theft or criminal damage to certain property.
Nevertheless, Judge Roll overruled Arizona state law protections and allowed MALDEF to proceed to attempt to sue Mr. Barnett for a whopping $32, 000, 000. After this ruling, the judge received over 200 death threats on his life and those of his family members.
Judge Roll was one of those killed today.
Why is the media not explaining who this man was and how his being there is significant, seeing as he, NOT Rep. Gifford, was the one who had actually had all the death threats?
Go figure. I guess they just don't want to talk about it....like so many other things the public should know....
Bob, what say you??????
No one said assinations or hurting people was the right thing to do in any sense. The guy was a fruitcake and now he is a murderer. Here you are saying this guy was a "righty" (god forbid) and you don't know anymore about him then the rest of us.
Everybody has their political agenda and yours is shines out brightly. Left is right and right is out.....
Trying to put words into peoples mouths (on a blog, no less), saying what you want but can't take the heat if someone backhands you.
Typical
T’aint. another palin mental mashup? ain't+tisn't?
"Sharron Angle.. 2nd amend remedies"
She didn't "make that up folks". That's been standard gunnut talk, since the Aryan Nation pre-Reagan era.
"But I’m not exhorting anyone to “target” them or “pick them off” or “take Second Amendment remedies.” "
Targeting,, Destroying,, Wiping,, Beating, are all ok.
The words that aren't ok are those explicitly inciting weapons use.
"Pick them off" (who used that?) is not good, no matter if somebody visualizes a bow or a something more modern.
The context of "2nd amend remedies" is ridiculously obvious, as are suggestions that "the tree of liberty" needs watering with blood. (clue to those who need a clue: RW nutcases aren't referring to *caterpillar* or *earthworm* blood, especially when they're flaunting their 45acp substitute for a d1kk)
BTW, i have met people (all adult male) who haven't yet reached that level of boldness (?) It doesn't take much for them to suddenly burst out, "i'll just shoot them" in reaction to some topic that annoys. Is it usually macho BS? Probably.
There are too many of these guys for anyone to "report" for psych eval. which means they can buy a gun and clips at their convenience. For a few, the metaphor "ticking time bomb" fits. The only consolation is that they're too stupid to learn effective weapons use.
http://radioornot.com/site/?cat=89
Loughner had no friends.
There's no evidence he listened to the radio or watched tv. If he did, I suspect there's no liberal local or syndicated radio broadcasting in Tucson. I don't watch much TV, so i guess that leaves olbermann and maddow on msnbc as only broadcast libs?
"leftist reading material such as "Mein Kampf" and "The Communist Manifesto"."
Pot smoking is statistically solid liberal choice, as crystal meth and whiskey are the rightwing preference.
But mein kampf is rightist (stromfront, metzger, white power, aryan nation, pat buchanan, conservative nazi apologists in letters to the editor, ad nauseum), and liberals are uninterested in marx and engels. Those authors are read by righties desperately digging for generationally obsolete rants.
"Heavy metal" (no longer called that, btw) has been a heartland/redstate/methstate thing since at least the early 90's. The only other choice on redstate radio is c&w;, also largely reruns from the 80's. (the nonmusical choice is ranttalk aka righttalk, but that's not musical.). People on the coasts in their 20's USUALLY listen to music that originated later (but tragically still conservative).
OTOH, the internet allows flyover kids to discover coasts kids likes...
Anyway, during the first hours of this Jan 8 news, some libs obsessed about turning Loughner into a rightie, while ALL of the righties obsessed about turning Loughner into a leftie. Both goals are silly. Loughner's a nut. His ideology was a mix of scattered extremes (alexjones, larouche, a super obscure black helicopters guy obsessed with grammar mind control theories, gold standard new world order nuttery, and something about dreams.). MOST rightwiggers just aren't quite that far gone.
BTW, regurgitating the tired RW borg talk that nazis were lefties simply makes you look stupid. You know it's propaganda.
The Republicans with Palin as their figurative leader have taken another quote from "The Untouchables" as a central theme: Al Capone said, in the film, "You can get further with a kind word and a gun than you can with just a kind word."
It's obvious from watching her that Palin possesses amateur gun-handling skills -- but it's a powerful prop for her political persona.
After absorbing all the southern racists who left the "Democrat Party" in the civil rights era, the GOP's hunger for votes led them to embrace the black gun crowd, the anti-abortion crowd (funny how Republicans never deliver on that topic) and religious fundamentalists who are anxiously awaiting the Rapture.
At the same time they've abandoned fiscal conservatism because all those constituencies must be fed, along with the GOP's corporate masters.
Any Republican who veers from the radical right agenda is quickly RINOed out of the party, and what you wind up with a boiled down essence of hate.
It's "my way or the highway," and it's the highway to hell for this country.
His anger at Giffords seems to date to 2007 when he asked her:"What is government if words have no meaning?" He was very angry that she did not give him the answer he wanted, and according to those who knew him carried a grudge about it.
That by the way predates the TEA party and Sarah Palin as a national figure.
By the way the photo is obviously photoshopped. Shame on New West.
If there is a lesson to be learned it is that it should be far better to require a psychiatric evaluation of individuals picked up because of complaints about their danger. It seems there were a multitude of warnings that were ignored. It is sad that anyone wants to create a political situation out of what is a psychiatric situation and ignore the true danger.
looks like a restrained bushism ;-)
That by the way predates the TEA party
No. The "tea party" never existed as a political party. Various *subsets* of the gop *named* themselves "something or other minutemen". Soon after some used names like "patriot something or other", soon followed by "tea party something or other", "tp express inc", etc.
Then they pushed certain GOP candidates for nov 2010. Anyway, the popularization/worship of violence is what's relevant. RW hatetalk has been in vogue since limbaugh circa 1989. The current RW penchant for explicit violence went 'bigtime' with the savage weiner circa 1999.
and Sarah Palin as a national figure.
True. But as with the 'tea parties', her pursuits are only some specific examples. Someone above posted a sampler vid of multiple violenttalkers (IOW, not palin). The overall promotion of violence is what's relevant to the destructive phenomenon.
====quote====
In the meantime, a high school friend of the 22-year-old Loughner remembers a man starkly different from the unstable man with the piercing mugshot stare. ..
"He wasn't shooting people, he was shooting at the world," Osler said.
Loughner's downward spiral and increasing anger began after a high school girlfriend broke up with him, Osler said. As a teenager, Loughner turned to heavy drinking and drugs, such as the legal hallucinogen salvia, Osler said.
"He would say he was using it, and he would talk about it and say what [it] would do to him and I was like, 'Dude, that's screwed up.'" ...
Loughner's onetime friend said that politics could not have been a motive in the alleged killing.
"He did not watch TV, he disliked the news," Osler said. "He didn't listen to political radio, he didn't take sides, he wasn't on the left, he wasn't on the right."
Osler pointed to an online documentary series called "Zeitgeist" as a possible influence on the man.
The series rails on currency-based economics.
"I really think that this 'Zeitgeist' documentary had a profound impact on Jared's mindset and how he viewed that world that he lives in," Osler said.
Osler also said that Loughner's favorite quote was "Out of chaos breathes creation."
===end quote===
As I said above about pop culture influences, connect the dots.
Um, is anyone else struck by the feeling that Slickhead was doing a Jodie Foster? I mean, the guy is SMILING in his official mug shot.
John Hinckley didn't have any kind of political agenda, he was just a nut. Squeaky Fromme? I guess she was a Mansonite which is pretty much equivalent to homicidal nut?
Let's also remember that it's been a long time (Jonestown) since a Congresskritter has been murdered. Let's keep in mind that Giffords ain't dead yet and I'm hoping she, like all the other wounded, has a speedy and FULL recovery.
And then she loses the next election.
The fact remains, Sheriff Dupnik seems to be digging his own political grave with his unprofessional, speculative conduct. So, too, is the "mainstream media" with their attempts to muzzle the Tea Party and/or Republicans and/or anyone who would express justified irritation at a fiscally irresponsible, profoundly clueless federal government leadership...which until a few days ago was all Dem, all the time.
Finally, as for the hate talk, I have XM/Sirius. Right there next to the patriot channel 166 is 167. And some of the stuff I hear, when I want a change of pace, is the same sort of gratituous slaggery spouted by old Kiss My Grits and Hash Mark. The "real" Left is, in my view, equally if not more guilty of vitriol and hate speech.
Don't try and look at this rationally and impute that reasoning to Loughner as if that's how he decided what to do.
By the way, gang, the Washington Post has a timeline with a youtube video from Slickhead. Put it up full size so you can read it.
It was a safe speech, and about our collective safety in a general sense. The speech was adult, fair minded, and probably a successful attempt at bringing about the beginning of the healing process. I would think that any person who wants to deride what he said, and take pot shots at his words and suggestions, should be able to withstand a shit load of criticism, all of which will be well deserved. Just my opinion. It was a speech worthy of the home State of Barry Goldwater, and one that I could very well could imagine hearing from Goldwater in the same circumstance. And I don't think Jimmy Carter would have gotten any later support if he had made a speech that was one inch to the left of what President Obama presented tonight. Whoever writes PBO's speeches (is it the guy who was Sen Baucus' chief of staff in the past?) did a fine job of taking the moral high ground, supporting our Constitution, and addressing the American people in a way that was inclusive and supportive of them. I give him an A+....
http://www.esquire.com/blogs/politics/political-violence-in-america-4834173
American apartheid? WTF! What is Allen West, then?
What is the common thread of influence in the many acts of violence by whackadoodles like Loughner?
Drugs.
Loughner -- salvia. See my discussion above.
Squeaky Fromme — drugs http://www.huffingtonpost.com/paul-krassner/my-acid-trip-with-squeaky_b_252681.html
Larry Harmon — drugs http://www-tech.mit.edu/archives/VOL_091/TECH_V091_S0417_P004.txt
John Hinckley — drugs http://www.health.am/psy/more/schizophrenia-typical-atypical-antipsychotic-medication/
"The Old Man and the Sea, after all, is a blueprint for violent mayhem right up there with The Anarchist’s Cookbook—and The Phantom Tollbooth may as well be subtitled “The Turner Diaries.”
Groups such as the Freemen dub themselves “Christian patriots,” while last spring, a clutch of Christian militia members in Michigan called the Hutaree planned to stage an attack on local law enforcement as part of the run-up to the endtimes. It’s true that Loughner disavowed organized religion—writing a propos of the government’s illegitimate currency that he refused to “trust in God.” But it’s hard to know what else to call a belief system that outfits an adherent so thoroughly for citizenship in an alternative reality. As the Southern Poverty Law Center notes, the sovereign community—or as it’s sometimes known, the redemption movement—shares many affinities with the separatist subculture of the fundamentalist world (right down, it seems, to the literalist misreading of key founding scripture.)
Armed with the bogus certitudes of an alternate theory of the authentic American republic, Loughner could envision a new currency, an improved English grammar, a career as a terrorist—all while fantasizing about the unconstitutionality of the community college from which he would soon be suspended."
====quote====
If, as has been discussed in recent days, their death helps usher in more civility in our public discourse, let us remember it is not because a simple lack of civility caused this tragedy–it did not–but rather because only a more civil and honest public discourse can help us face up to the challenges of our nation in a way that would make them proud.
===end quote===
Y'all get that "it did not" part? Pougue, y'all can take off your tin foil hats now.
http://interested-party.blogspot.com/2011/01/domestic-terrorism-awake-in-red-states.html
===quote===
1. He didn't watch TV and disliked news
Zach Osler, a high school friend of Loughner's, told ABC's "Good Morning America" that the alleged shooter was not obsessed with politics or the news. In fact, Loughner didn't even watch TV. "He disliked the news," said Osler. "He didn't listen to political radio. He didn't take sides. He wasn't on the left, he wasn't on the right."
2. His parents are loners...
3. He was a bad poet
Loughner took an advanced poetry-writing class last year, for which he composed odes to "bland tasks such as showering, going to the gym and riding the bus," reports CBS News. In class, Loughner would read his poems in a "wild 'poetry slam' style," grabbing his crotch like a hip-hop star and "jumping around the room." During one class, he burst out laughing when another student read a poem about abortion. He was finally ejected from the class after talking about "strapping guns to babies."
4. He loved conspiracy theories
Loughner's favorite movies include Loose Change, the 9/11 "Truther" conspiracy movie, and he was obsessed with supposed government cover-ups. He believed that the U.S. government was attempting to create a unified monetary system to impose control on the rest of the world, and that it was attempting to brainwash the population by "controlling grammar." He also believed the moon landings were faked.
5. He was a videogame fan
6. A break-up may have sent him over the edge...
7. He was a heavy drug user
Various former friends and associates claim that Loughner became a frequent drug user in recent years — consuming "marijuana, cocaine, psilocybin mushrooms," and salvia, a legal hallucinogen, on a regular basis. His application to join the U.S. Army was denied after he failed a drug test.
8. He was a dog lover...
9. He was pulled over by police on the day of the shooting...
===end quote===
Deal with reality.
The billboards said " Rush Limbaugh ...Straight Shooter " KNST 790 ( a Clear Channel affiliate ). The billboard's design featured graphics of bullet holes .
Ooops.
You really have to ask : if the media climate had not heated up so fiercely with the rise of conservative talk and Fox News and right wing punditry spun out of control since 1992 , would Loughner have taken his first shot directly a a Democratic Jewish woman Congressman. Don't wackos like this usually take it out on schools or some other entity that directly offended him ?
Loughner was one deranged guy holding a gun , but the distinct choice of target and when- where -why indicates there were many fingers on the trigger. A conscious act driven by a tortured subconscious. "The voices...the voices made me do it."
Democrats, liberals, and socialists don't rabblerouse like this. The Right Wing has some soul searching to do , and atonement would be nice. Sarah Palin has not been helpful here. The very media she decries is the same gun she herself is also holding and firing, analogously. Before the rise of Right Wing Radio and All Conservative All the Time cable video, and Tea Bagger, it was rightly said that the medium is the message. But these days the message is also the medium. And that's dangerous. We even see some of it right here in this rural backwater of NewWest.net's comment forums.
What's the difference between the barrel of a Glock .45 and Sarah Palin's mouth reading from a scripted eleprompter? Lipstick.
Please ask yourself how many "troubled" "unstable" "mentally ill," loners are there sitting in their moldy, dirty apartments reading your vile sputem and plotting to take their Prius with the "coexist" sticker on it and head to Alaska to do harm to Mrs. Palin or any other conservative along the way?? Would her blood be on your hands, would you take any responsibility? I can answer that... of course not, because free speach gives you the right to say whatever you want and "that crazy person" had his reasons... right? So please spare us all your hypocritical politics, trust me your opinion means nothing to me!
The Left’s “Chutzpah” continually exploits new opportunities to keep their fear and hate bandwagon rolling and their true believers seething and in line. Truth be damned.
They can only RAHM it through in a crisis.
That all said, here's best wishes not only for all the wounded, but specifically for Gabrielle Giffords. If she recovers a hundred percent and returns to office, that's the best outcome.
And if she goes right back to doing Congress on the Corner, that's best of all.
Do you think about or even begin to realize what you're saying ...ever? ...or do you just say it?
Roosevelt's economic boosts by public spending put food on tables, kept roofs over heads, but did not end the economic malaise. WWII and the united effort to win a war put everyone to work because 14 million men in uniform put a hole in the work force, which put a substantial number of women to work in their place. Two incomes. And rationed goods. People saved and the US Govt spent their savings on war materials.
The most amazing benefit of the Depression, and the war that ended it, was that the whole of the process was an organized, quasi-military, and then full bore military, chain of command organization that expect and demanded a level of obedience and thought from every level of responsibility. From the CCC camps, the WPA projects, to the military and the logistics of building 10,000 ships, 125,000 airplanes, 500,000 tanks, all the stuff of military life and the equipment to wage war, there was an ongoing MBA project for every officer behind the front lines all the way to the Capitol. When the war ended, the US had all the people in place, trained, to run any and all kinds of business and bureaucracy. That is what made this country the economic leader of the world. Our factories were standing at the end of the war, and were quickly put back into civilian use. But the organizational training was still with the personnel. People knew how to operate as a team. People knew how to plan critical path process. That collective experience of The War made the factories hum. And I doubt if we still have that. I think that a whole lot of the group effort deal has eroded, and it is now about me, and I did this, and we must recognize the individual, and it is about self worth, and self confidence. The narcissist nation of numbskulls pounding their chests when they do what they are paid to do.
So I will give you the Roosevelt legacy, albeit one he inherited as the tyrants of the Axis nations were not taking the USA seriously and foolishly went about trying to conquer the world under the flag of national socialism, and Roosevelt was thrown into the fray by Pearl Harbor. Nothing he did before the war was effectively going to end the economic malaise. Just like the housing bubble and the dot com before that, the Great Depression was about speculation in the stock markets and the loss of markets as Europe recovered from WWI and no longer needed US aid and goods. That farming had mechanized between the wars did not help provide jobs. That an agrarian economy over produced did not help. That banks failed as good loans went bad, was eerily familiar in the past three years. That retail banking went from "bank by the numbers" to the free wheeling unrestrained banking of the 1990s, and the end result was once again bank failures, although this time covered by deposit insurance for most small accounts. At least this time there was a train of succession for banks, and service was never interrupted, as all takeovers seem to occur at 5:00pm on friday, and on monday morning, a new bank is running your old bank. And to think that social security is on the chopping block due to its cost and the inability of folks to earn enough money to pay the taxes to support the SSI for future generations. Congress, which has been mostly Democrat for most of the last 60 years, used SSI as a Ponzi to fund pork barrel spending and garner re election chits by providing gifts of other people's money. The Democrat party has been the leveler of the Roosevelt legacy. Progressives need to look in the mirror to see the enemy. It is they who overspent the community fortune. On either side of the aisle. And why not, when you can borrow trillions and still get re elected??
Not too many jumping out windows. Bernie Madoff's son offed himself, a self inflicted honor killing. It took over 50 years for banks to go from highly regulated to virtually non regulated, and wherever the center is seems to be passed as the pendulum swings one way or t'other. But we do self center, eventually, and it is always a painful process. Obama is doing it as I write. And always there is finger pointing, and yelling, and threats, and a general lowering of the bar of civility. We do survive, these United States. We do survive, and we do have our bumps and nicks, and bruising of the past comity during our national discussions. Our country does not need mandated, legislated additions to law to tone down the level of rhetoric. What it really needs is more jobs. People with jobs who can house and feed their families are happier than people who are on some sort of dole and not "getting by." I often wonder if Congress is aware of that concept. JOBS. Jobs will tone down the rhetoric. The vitriol. The anger. Work at finding ways to create jobs, and the restiveness will go away of its own volition. Until election time, and then your mythical House member, Rep. Xavier Onnassis, will build a fire of discontent, throw gas on it, and then blame his or her opponent. Mine was into the newspaper on sunday last sounding the alarm that Rush Limbaugh and Glen Beck were the instigators of the Tucson shoot 'em up. I would hope his wife will take the time, now that she was defeated in her quest to continue his spot in the Oregon legislature, to braid his tail and clean his shoes, so that at the least, he is a presentable horse's ass. So far, all of the letters to the editor in the local paper, the one of the State Capitol, have been critical of his spewing of lefty vitriol. The left leaning editors evidently have chosen which letters to print, as they do, and none defending his assault on the rights of free speech have been printed. Just maybe it was because he spoke with zero knowledge of the facts, and was very much the parrot to the Pima country Sheriff's ill advised rant. I wonder when the locals tell the Sheriff that it appears his department was not doing its job, and maybe the laws on mental illness need attention, as the cops stopped the kid earlier in the day, and since none, nobody, had taken an official stance on his outbursts of insanity in public places, he could not be officially held on any charges until he had done some reprehensible act. Which he did. And the crowd got him when he had to reload. I guess, as has been hinted, that whoever got his gun told the shooter that maybe the answer was for him to shoot the creep right now. And had better thoughts about it. Thank you, for that, who ever you were. Now we get to see to what extent the progressives will go to help a mentally deranged life time doper, slacker, and faux philosopher. Gee. Their kinda guy.
BTW, there is no better assessment of FDR's impact on the depression, than his Treasury Secretary, Henry Morgenthau. HM said: "“I say after eight years of this Administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started. … And an enormous debt to boot!”
The beatification of FDR is utter nonsense.
Just like the communist Obama who wanted to redistribute wealth so there might no longer be any hunger in America.
Perhaps you should grow up, as in mature, and see what's going on: http://www.verumserum.com/?p=20646
===quote===
Palin gets a full court press leading to death threats and Van Hollen gets a complete pass for essentially the same behavior. Somebody out there want to tell me there’s no liberal media?
===end quote===
The chutzpah of those like yourself to cast aspersions in only one direction is the motivation for much of the concerns expressed here contrary to the argument of this post.
Even President Obama doesn't buy your BS. He said:
"
If, as has been discussed in recent days, their death helps usher in more civility in our public discourse, let us remember it is not because a simple lack of civility caused this tragedy–it did not–but rather because only a more civil and honest public discourse can help us face up to the challenges of our nation in a way that would make them proud."
Notice the "-it did not-".
If Palin was in the Animal Rights movement she would have been indicted, sentenced and imprisoned long ago. To draw a specific comparison: the SHAC 7 were convicted of “animal enterprise terrorism” for running a website which posted the names and addresses of individuals tied to the animal testing lab Huntingdon Life Sciences. They were not charged with any act of property destruction, they were charged with “conspiracy” on the grounds that they should be held accountable for the actions of others in the same movement.
Sarah Palin never burned a building down. Never sabotaged someone's equipment. Never broke into a mink farm and released mink into the wild. Never burned a cottonwood cloning research facility. Never threw blood at people on the street who had been in a fur salon. If you think that I would have sympathy for someone prosecuted for abetting sabotage of private property or actively recruiting people to do just that, you have the wrong guy.
Perhaps we should wonder if the environmental saboteurs smoked too much dope, as is the claim against the Tucson shooter. Did too many drugs. Chemically changed his mind to some irrational font of hatred and confusion. Or so his contacts from childhood until last friday have stated.
And, Kiss My Ass, just what history courses do you suggest I take?? Whose view of yesterday do you champion? History courses are, after all, beauty contests with preconceived notions of who did what, when and why, all according to the author. Or instructor. American political history is made fifty years in arrears as documents from each administration may be sealed for up to fifty years. I was well out of college when the WWII archives were opened, and the deepest secrets of the Roosevelt Administration were open for all to read. They are pored over by academics who claim some expertise on the issues, and then the books come out, with all the winners and losers, admired or derided, as hindsight provides. The beauty contest is under way. And of course, due to new insight and dead witnesses, revisions of history begin. Each reader's cumulative experience and pages read direct his or her conclusions. I would say yours are different than mine, but neither of us can claim to know except from our readings. I was there, but shitting in diapers. I do remember kids singing "whistle while you work, Truman is a jerk. Mussolini pulled his weenie, now it doesn't work." The first off color ditty of first grade. In my mind, Truman was a better President than Roosevelt. Got more positive things done. Accomplished. Ended a war. Saved Europe from famine and Stalin. Stood his ground with China and communist Asia. Recovered a domestic economy. And took a walk every day in retirement, down the streets of Independence, Missouri. Even after two Puerto Rican nationalists tried to assassinate him during his second term as President. Truman had integrity and guts. It was he who said if he hadn't gotten into politics, he probably would have been the piano player in a whorehouse. A guy who understood who he was. Do Irish guys still play piano in whorehouses?
Truman ended segregation in the military. Southern Democrat? Like I said, he had guts, and the fortitude to what was right, even in the face of intense political opposition. Nobody liked him, publicly, but he beat Dewey like a prairie rug, which meant that he got votes from people who would not say publicly that they voted for him.
People talked about Truman like they talked about Bush II. And then they both get elected. Funny how that works. Was it the Captain Jack Aubrey "I'd prefer the lesser of the two weevils" vote or a secret admiration for their "sticking to his guns" forthrightness? None of which explains why some dumb ass psycho kid shoots up a town hall meeting with a congresswoman. Shit happens. People go off their rockers. Random acts of violence are part and parcel to social living. We would like to have reasons for those events, but by now, we should know that there are not any calculated, sane reasons. And no way to invade lives to find candidates for outbursts of insane violence. That "freedom" stuff gets in the way. Or, in economic terms, spending a few billions to save a nickel's worth of public safety. And then failing to protect our most basic freedoms.
This is how the real world works. Across the street, there lives a lady in her fifties, single, who is a PhD college prof with a mentally ill brother on the East Coast who has been doing just fine for thirty years because he takes his meds, has had family interventions long ago, and is successfully living his life, all the while invaded with this mental disease. And she stayed home all day saturday, sunday and monday after the Tucson violence, crying, because she knows in her heart that at one time, it could have been her brother going nutzoid in an act of public violence. That, and the fact that he is 3000 miles away, and she could not be there for him if something went henshit. Her issues are with the ACLU, which was forever blocking any and all attempts her family was making to secure stability for her brother so long ago and their parents were alive. And she, as liberal as they come, hates the ACLU for incessant roadblocks to getting help to the mentally ill. That is her story. I am just passing it along. That "freedom" thing again. We are not unlike those vast flocks of birds that migrate in huge flocks knowing that someone is going to get picked off along the way, but if they flew individually, many, many more would get picked off by predators. 300,000,000+ Americans, and if you know some are going to do harm to others every day. We need to understand personal safety cannot be guaranteed. We do need to know that personal freedom can be guaranteed. That is the core issue. That is what we have to protect. White pride? Or just appreciating what the Founding Fathers strove to enact in their imperfect way?
I hope when NW makes its announced comment policy changes they address such nonsense.
White Pride, where did you come up with that? I agree pride in being an american for some is a touchy subject....
Using bearbaits logic....My great grandfather came over here from Norway (slang...fisheaters, yep, they had racism against people then also...) He could not speak the language spoken here. The first thing he wanted was to speak fluently because americans speak english....He left his country and adapted to the ideals and customs we have here.
Now, we have people coming here that do not want these values. They want their own language, their own way of doing things. Nothing wrong with that, to a point. We still eat norweagean foods at christmas and holidays. But when you have an entire subculture with different values to the point where they think some laws don't apply to them, or they isolate their communities with the language barrier I sometimes wonder why they came. Obviously alot of places in the world are worse than here and maybe thats why they come.
Bearbait and racism? Never read that into anything he has ever said....appears to boil down to the fact that he does not agree with your assumed logic very often.....
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/columnists/ct-oped-0113-chapman-20110112,0,1074928.column
It does not matter if the shooter in Tuscon-Jared Loughner,was from the left,right,an independent,or a man from mars-he committed a crime,a horrible crime,no one "made him do it" Not sarah Palin and her map ,not beck,Limbaugh,Hamkity,or any other TV or radio show host,no author made him do it,no one but Jared Loughner made him do it,the man had obvious mental issues.
IF during the course of an NICS background check,mental health records could be accessed,maybe there would be fewer mass shootings-thank the ACLU for not allowing law enforcement access to mental health records. Both the Va. Tech,and the tuscon shootings may have been prevented if law enforcement had access to mental health records.
Blaming the media is absurd,as I said, no one but the shooter is to blame.
===quote===
Lee said at the time that he experienced an ‘‘awakening” when he watched former Vice President Al Gore’s environmental documentary ‘‘An Inconvenient Truth.”
===end quote===
Craig Moore you are a bad american.
It's funny and quite revealing that you don't criticize others who try to falsely blame Palin for inspiring Loughner. In the Discovery Channel incident, the inspiration connection comes from the gunman's mouth.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/16/us/16loughner.html?pagewanted=1&_r=3&adxnnlx=1295272816-mzPTbiXmgfYK5d56DmiDjg
And also the documents relating to him and his problems at the college.
http://documents.nytimes.com/jared-loughner-pima-community-college-documents?ref=us
Then ask the question why didn't anyone get help for him? Especially law enforcement and his parents.
By the way he apparently hated George W. Bush.
===quote===
The Tucson shootings afforded another, quite different illustration of the pressure of time in news coverage — not pressure measured in seconds and minutes, but pressure that news organizations feel to define the context of a story, to set up a frame for it, sometimes before the facts can be fully understood.
The Times’s day-one coverage in some of its Sunday print editions included a strong focus on the political climate in Arizona and the nation. For some readers — and I share this view to an extent — placing the violence in the broader political context was problematic...
The Times had a lot of company, as news organizations, commentators and political figures shouldered into an unruly scrum battling over whether the political environment was to blame. Meanwhile, opportunities were missed to pick up on evidence — quite apparent as early as that first day — that Jared Lee Loughner, who is charged with the shootings, had a mental disorder and might not have been motivated by politics at all…
Still, I think the intense focus on political conflict — not just by The Times — detracted from what has emerged as the salient story line, that of a mentally ill individual with lawful access to a gun.
Whether covering the basic facts of a breaking story or identifying more complex themes, the takeaway is that time is often the enemy. Sometimes the best weapon against it is to ignore it, and use a moment to consider the alternatives.
It’s not easy being a San Francisco leftie living in Missoula, so every chance he gets he runs to the “left coast” for a leftie fix. But I can understand why ol’ Bob lives in Missoula instead of San Francisco; he wants to protect his children from being infected by liberalism a disease he can’t shake.
It is the same disease that afflicts Larry Kurtz, Mickey Garcia, Pogey Bait, Ken, horst and the like.
I could point out volumes of leftie hate speech, but it would fall on deaf ears.
My ears aren't deaf, Spud. Fire away. The definition of a Liberal is " open minded" and inclusive.
You guys don't meet the classical definition of liberal. You are leftists, and want government to control everything you don't like. Just as long as you can smoke what you want and sleep with what you want, and as long as the government keeps everyone else from doing what they want, you're good.
All the howling about right wing crazies being at fault in Phoenix when none, absolutely none of it, came to pass? And who came unglued at the town hall in Phoenix? A "liberal" who brooks no dissent.
In other words, a leftist totalitarian with all the answers. No need for an open mind. And the only part of leftist totalitarianism that is inclusive, is everyone is included in the master plan.
Sorta makes them adlibs in a grass G-sting.
===quote===
The new found civility didn’t last long. Political rhetoric in Congress doesn’t get much nastier than the words of one House Democrat during the debate on repealing the health care law.
In an extraordinary outburst on the House floor, Rep. Steve Cohen (D-TN) invoked the Holocaust to attack Republicans on health care and compared rhetoric on the issue to the work of infamous Nazi propagandist Joseph Goebbels.
===end quote===
I apologize for not attaching your name to the esteemed leftie list. I hope your little whine about being called a leftie is just for show not an effort to gain victimhood status. If I’m going to banter with a leftie I want a Joe Biden leftie who is _ing proud to be a leftie.
All that, aside it was interesting to observe most left wing leaders avoid references to attaching blame to conservatives, Jonathan Chait of The New Republic quickly published an editorial pleading with his readers to avoid trying to lay these murders at the foot of the Republicans. His readers quickly turned on him, “JC you are joking, right? Get out of DC and see what's going on in the rest of the country”, then a link to the HuffPo. Others wanted to know what alien life form had taken over Chait’s body.
If you don’t know who Chait is, he is a piped piper of liberals; they hang on his every word, but not today… “By "random act" what Chait really means is that the perpetrator is mentally ill, and that explains his violent act. Chait and Jack Shafer should jointly share the 2011 Neanderthal award.”
As we know political rhetoric usually goes over the top and Obama is not exception:
“I want you to argue with them and get in their face” September 2008
“I don’t want to quell anger. I think people are right to be angry! I’m angry!” ACORN rally March 2010
“We are going to punish our enemies and we’re going to reward our friends who stand with us on issues that are important to us” Latino rally October 2010
Leftie talking heads keep the fires burning;
"We ought to rip [Dick Cheney's heart] out and kick it around and stuff it back in him," MSNBC's Ed Schultz blustered on his February 24, 2010 radio program.
MSNBC’s Chris Matthews in 2009 fantasized about the death of Rush Limbaugh: “Somebody’s going to jam a CO2 pellet into his head and he’s going to explode like a giant blimp”
MSNBC’s Amy Robach in 2006 mildly wondered if “Death of a President” movie depicting the imagined assassination of President Bush was “poor taste or, as some say, thought-provoking?”
On his radio show in 2009, Ed Schultz wished for Dick Cheney’s death: “He is an enemy of the country, in my opinion, Dick Cheney is, he is an enemy of the country … Lord, take him to the Promised Land, will you?”
Then-Air America host Montel Williams in 2009 urged Congresswoman Michele Bachmann to kill herself: “Slit your wrist! Go ahead! I mean, you know, why not? I mean, if you want to – or, you know, do us all a better thing. Move that knife up about two feet. I mean, start right at the collarbone.”
“I’m just saying if he did die, other people, more people would live. That’s a fact.” — Host Bill Maher on his HBO show Real Time, March 2, 2007, discussing how a few commenters at a left-wing blog were upset that an attempt to kill Vice President Cheney in Afghanistan had failed.
“Earlier today, a rental truck carried a half a million ballots from Palm Beach to the Florida Supreme Court there in Tallahassee. CNN had live helicopter coverage from the truck making its way up the Florida highway, and for a few brief moments, America held the hope that O.J. Simpson had murdered Katherine Harris.” — Bill Maher on ABC’s Politically Incorrect, November 30, 2000.
“I hope his wife feeds him lots of eggs and butter and he dies early like many black men do, of heart disease....He is an absolutely reprehensible person.” — USA Today columnist and Pacifica Radio talk show host Julianne Malveaux on Justice Clarence Thomas, November 4, 1994 PBS To the Contrary.
Even today after all the talk of civility the website for Wal-Mart Free DC prominently features the Wal-Mart smiley-face icon at the center of crosshairs in an advertisement for a "March on the Developer's House" in Northwest D.C. tomorrow at 7:30 p.m.
And CNN is falling all over themselves apologizing for using the highly flamable term crosshairs in some political reporting today, Gawd thats funny.
Think about it: except for the attacks of September 11 (because some would argue that that was a case of domestic terrorism, too) mass killings take place overwhelmingly more often in red states.
Timothy McVeigh was 27, Eric Robert Rudolph, part of the Christian Identity movement, was 30, Eric Harris was 18 and Dylan Klebold, 17, Seung-Hui Cho was 23, Nidal Hasan was 39, Jared Loughner, 22. Average age--25 years. The acts of domestic terrorism were all committed by these guys in red states. All seven men were victims of bullying, isolation, and ostracism. All seven had histories of extensive video game exposure and easy access to firearms. Distrust of government was a factor in most, if not all of these episodes. Ted Kaczinski, likely master of the minds in all these events, punctuates this post since he resided in Montana, a red state when, at 36, his activism morphed. His case changes the average age to 26.5.
Red states are failing their populations.
http://interested-party.blogspot.com/2011/01/glenn-beck-anwar-al-awlaki-of-zionist.html
As I said above:
"The shooter was 22 years old. Others observed that he was a drug and alcohol abuser. He sacred the sh*t out of people so much that he was banned from his CC. Both he and his parents were loners. He liked to read. He was a registered independent and didn’t vote in 2010.
Now, are young people who don’t vote more attuned to pop culture influences (violent video games, movies, hip hop lyrics, and literature) or political pundits?
Why does the Left avoid the OBVIOUS influences in his life and latch onto the specious other than to score political points in the manner of Rahm Emmanuel’s advice to never let a crisis go to waste?"
Larry, deal with the obvious before grasping tight to the specious.
No end to people who think that there has to be blame assigned, and that is probably because we are up to our collective ass in trial lawyers looking to make a quick million or more. And they seem to support the Blue State creed of micro management of the human condition. They feel only they, the prodigal left, have the innate ability and calling to run every life but their own. I have a rolling donut for them to take a run at.
Loughner was going to make a name for himself, and he did it with a gun. Some do it with explosives, and where once you could buy explosives to use in private land management, now they are reserved and micro managed by government. We just pay more for how we do things. Hiring a track hoe to do in days what powder could have done in a day or two. The Nanny State controls our safety, but in reality does not. Loughner proved that. The ACLU has made sure none can be held on suspicion of mental instability. And Loughner gave them enough evidence over time to show he was tragically unstable. The freedom to not be judged insane is also the freedom for the insane to exhibit anti social behavior, with bad results.
This assignment of blame to Red States is disingenuous, at the least. There is not one bit of statistical data to examine all 50 states, and to trend random acts of violence. Is there a limit or a base to how many are killed/and/or wounded to qualify? Is one insane killing not statistically relevant? How many wounded are relevant?? Is there a method?? We have had California Blue State serial killers of note. And one from Washington, another Blue state. And gee, several from the upper midwest, all Blue states. Are gang killings scored?? How about Washington DC being many times more dangerous on a murder or death by violence per 100,000 population, than US military duty in Afghanistan or Iraq?? Or Mayor, now Governor, Moonbeam's Fabulous killing ground, Oakland, CA?? 400,000 people, none ever being killed while serving in Iraq or Afghanistan, but a murder rate of around a 100 every year, and another 500 or more gun shot wounded or stab wounded, but surviving. Nice place, that Oakland. To stay the hell away from!!! and so are any number of other California cities with rampant gang banging and random acts of violence. Is that a Blue State requirement??? Lots of them have similar places with similar violence quotients.
There is no blame to lay in Arizona except on the shooter, himself. And if the sheriff wants to lay some, he should be made to be looking in a mirror while he addresses the media. It happened on his shift, in his county, by a person his law enforcement community had been made aware of. There. I laid some blame, thus proving I am as hypocritical as the good sheriff. Who's next???
Adjust your tinfoil hat to another channel.
See any connection there?
For left-wing violence you got arson at an unoccupied ski resort built on public land, a few SUVs torched at dealerships and maybe some PETA fanatics letting loose some minks. You have to go back 40 years and Bill Ayers -- and the Weathermen's most successful bombing was when they blew up their own townhouse.
Hasan? Are you that delusional, Mister? Soldier of Allah? Only in Texas because that's where he was pre-deployment? Video game influence? Only if Al-Whatever produces Kill Infidels mullah-approved items.
If that's a leap of your logic, you just missed the cliff.
One human's dogma is another's giant Ponzi scheme. Ted Kaczinski wrote the treatise for the TEA movement: http://cyber.eserver.org/unabom.txt
All these men found themselves in Ted's handbasket on the TEAter-totter of totalitarianism tautology.
Glenn Beck is the Anwar al Awlaki of the Zionist Right.
The Unabomber is their godfather.
You believe 9/11 was an inside job by Bush and Cheney, dont you.